The Vine: December 16, 2009
Hey Sars,
So, I’m not going to bore you with the same “my cat pees out of the litterbox” question.He had urinary stones, they’ve been dealt with, he still pees inappropriately.I deal with it.Here’s my question for you: do you know of any way to “cleanse the palate” of your nose, to be able to smell what you’re used to?
Even though I clean the spots rigorously, I worry that my house has the patented “Cat Stench.”I ask friends to be honest with me, but…that has not turned out well for me in the past.(Really, I know I’m a nice person, but when I ask for an honest assessment, don’t tell me my house smells of roses when it’s more like rose fertilizer!)
I’ve tried the perfumer’s trick of inhaling coffee beans and then sniffing, but I still can’t tell if we’re “normal cat” level or “crazy cat lady” level. Any other hints?
I get all my exercise from scrubbing pee-spots
Dear Ex,
I also have a horror of The Cat Stench — or, really, that my apartment features The Cat Stench and I’ve stopped noticing.My cats, knock wood, confine their peeing to the box, but my apartment isn’t very big, and certainly a piquant Hobey poo fills the joint in no time flat.
My best gauge of the relative levels of TCS is to go out for the day.I get accustomed to other smells, or no smells, and when I get back home, I smell everything anew — whether the trash needs to go out, whether I left the coffee on the hot plate too long, whether the litter is getting ripe.
It’s still probably more noticeable to people who don’t live there, but I think you do get almost the full effect just by spending time elsewhere for a day or two.
Dear Sars,
I’m so embarrassed to be 26 and somehow have missed out on developing the skill of dealing with this, but here goes. I’m a woman with a long-term, long-distance boyfriend. Every so often, I meet new people who don’t know about said boyfriend. Occasionally, they ask me out. Or, more confusingly for me, they ask me if I want to get dinner or coffee or hang out sometime, and I think they’re asking me out, but I’m not completely sure, because those are all things I do with my friends of either sex.
I want a good standard response that will not lead them on, not be rude, invite friendship if that’s what we’re both after, and minimize the awkwardness for all parties. I don’t have the greatest social skills in general, but I believe I can learn! (Actually, there’s a lot of autism in my family, which may explain why I need more explicit instruction in handling interactions than do most people.)
In case this context helps: yesterday I got an email from a classmate asking me to dinner. I thought it was pretty unambiguously a date request. My impulse was to write something pretty straightforward, along the lines of: “Hanging out sometime would be great. Now here’s the awkward part: I wasn’t sure how to interpret your email. I’ve got a boyfriend. But if you mean friendly dinner, sounds great.”
My roommate and best friend both convinced me this was a horrible idea, and I wound up sending something more like, “Hanging out would be great! My availability is limited, because I often visit my boyfriend, who lives in another city, on weekends. But let’s find a time when we can.” I sent it, but I felt very awkward and fake. It seemed so transparent that I’m not sure it was actually more kind. Like, if you ask someone out like that, you know the answer might be no; is it just patronizing if they pretend they misunderstood?
Later that same day, I ran into a former classmate I’d always enjoyed chatting with, and we talked for a while. He asked if I’d want to get coffee sometime, and I said sure and gave him my phone number. Then it occurred to me that maybe that was an invitation to a date as well, and I felt like a jerk for leading him on. This has happened before and I always vow to avoid it next time around, but I don’t know how because I don’t know what to say instead. Please help!
I know it’s not a big deal to say no, so why can’t I figure out how to say it?
Dear No,
Is it “no” you want to say?Because in that case, yes, you should just say it.”I’m sorry, I won’t be able to.””That sounds great, but I’m afraid I can’t.”
But if what you actually want to say is, “I’d like to hang out with you platonically, but if this is a date, I can’t go because I have a boyfriend,” you…could just say that, too, but it’s a bit presumptuous for every situation.Maybe it’s part of your social-skills issue that you can’t tell when it’s a date request and when it’s a hang-out request, and I don’t have the best radar for that either, but it’s generally not all that ambiguous; you can usually suss out when you should mention the boyfriend and when you needn’t bother.
But if you want a default, you could go with something like, “Sounds fun — but I think my boyfriend and I might have plans that day/night, so let me check my schedule to make sure.”
As a sidebar, I’ve seldom encountered this on either side, because I feel like people in relationships tend to mention the other person fairly frequently — not as an out-of-context announcement, but the “my girlfriend likes that show” or “my fiancé was just saying” type of thing.I’d extend that to relationships generally, not just romantic ones; you talk to someone for 10-15 minutes, you can get a general layout of their circle based on who’s mentioned and who’s not.(And it goes the other way as well.On occasion, a wife is noticeably not brought up and you have to think there’s a reason.)I’ll have to listen for that the next time I meet someone and get into conversation with him/her, because I don’t know if I’m right about that, but I think I am.
Not that you should go around randomly inserting your boyfriend into conversations on my say-so, but that these prospective suitors talk to you long enough to want to ask you out again, and yet the boyfriend doesn’t come up during that time, is interesting.Again, not a judgment.
Hiya, Sars.
Oh, the holidays. This letter is such a cliché (zomg holiday family dramz? NO WAY) but honestly, I could use a reality check.
The situation: My sister is married and has two kids. Her husband has a large extended family and they all live in the same area, while my parents live about three hours from them. I, on the other hand, live about 15 hours away, and am single. Now, it has come to pass that, now that my sister has kids, my parents and I all make the trek to her house for Xmas, because it’s easier for them not to travel with the kids, and because that way, her kids get to see both their sets of grandparents.
But here’s the thing: I really don’t like it. As nice as her in-laws are, they’re not my family, and everything always seems to end up being really stressy, because the kids (my niece and nephew and their cousins — and little kids are seriously like my kryptonite) are all hopped up on sugar and toys, and because the in-laws are yellers (affectionate yellers, but still) and because all of that is on top of the stress of dealing with my own parents.
Here’s the immediate crisis: This year, my sister and BIL moved into a new, much larger house. In previous years, it was agreed that my (medium-sized) dog would not come to Christmas, because their old house was just too small. So this year, I called and said, “Hey, now that the house is so much bigger and has a fenced yard, can Dog come?” Sister said she would check with her husband and call me back, and when she did, she announced that yes, Dog could come — IF Dog stayed locked up in their basement, “and you can sleep down there with her!” Gee, can I? Thanks. (I should point out that there are two perfectly good guest bedrooms upstairs, one of which would not be occupied if I slept in the basement.)
So, I get that they are trying to compromise there, but at the same time, I’m getting a pretty clear message that Dog is actually not welcome, and I’m not particularly down with keeping my dog locked in a basement (or sleeping in one myself).
Because I am going to be a guest in their home, and I think it is courteous to try to be respectful of my hosts’ wishes, I make arrangements for Dog to stay at a kennel in my parents’ town. I will drop her off Christmas Eve, drive to my sister’s, do the Christmas morning thing, then drive back on Christmas afternoon to pick up Dog. I will do this because A) I am kind of poor, and can’t afford to board her for a bunch of nights and B) because, hi, I love my dog and would actually rather not stick her in a kennel for longer than I have to. I think I’ve got it worked out pretty well.
BUT NO. Because when my sister finds out I am leaving Christmas afternoon, there are tears and recriminations. Apparently I am ruining Christmas by doing this. Whereas I think I am actually doing my bit by making arrangements to show up sans dog for Christmas Eve, kid present extravaganza, and enormous family brunch (despite really not wanting to go at all in the first place) and not just to show up, but to show up cheerfully, with lots of presents and Christmas spirit. I am, furthermore, going to be spending New Year’s and several days before that with them, so it’s not like this is our only chance to see each other over the holidays.
So here are the things that are in play as I see it:
A) The immediate problem: I am resentful that, because I am trying to be a good guest by boarding Dog — who, rightly or wrongly, I consider my family — I am being guilt-tripped about leaving Christmas afternoon.
B) The larger problem: I love my sister and want to spend time with her, but am resentful that my needs always seem to come second to her needs around the holidays, and that every member of both families seems to think that this is the natural course of things, since I am a childless spinster who should be happy to join someone else’s family. (I, it should be said, would be more than happy to tuck up alone with a pizza and a bottle of champers on any given holiday. I guess the thing that really gets my goat here is that I know that if I were married, no one would even give it a second thought that I wasn’t around every other Christmas, but because I’m not, that’s not an option.)
And, finally, the question(s):
Per Problem A: Am I being ridiculously selfish for leaving Christmas afternoon? I am genuinely trying to be a good team player here, but am I just delusional? Should I leave the 26th instead?
Per Problem B: If I am being selfish, isn’t that okay sometimes? Shouldn’t we get to take turns about it? Or am I condemned to a lifetime of putting on my game face and being the 153rd wheel at my sister’s in-laws’ family gatherings, because that is the generous thing to do?
The Grinch, Who Lives Just North of Whoville
Dear Grinch,
A) No.B) In theory, yes, but you have to live in reality.
In order to deal with this situation, which is really two situations, I think you have to set aside temporarilty the fact that you don’t really want to be there.You have chosen to go this year; deal with the particulars of that first.
Tell your sister, nicely, what you just told me about Dog.Dog is your family too; it’s unpleasant for her and expensive for you to kennel her for an extended period, and the alternative (the two of you spend the holiday in the basement) is, while you appreciate your sister’s position on it, frankly not appealing to you either.This is the solution you have come up with.You didn’t intend to upset your sister, but: this is the solution you’ve come up with.
I wouldn’t mention that the herd of overexcited kids and yelly adults is not your jam; I wouldn’t mention that you’d prefer a little more equity in the holiday arrangements.Deal with this issue, which is about Dog, and do it by explaining your reasoning, reassuring her that you look forward to spending time with her at New Year’s, and not bargaining.Dog is important to you; you have to leave Christmas Day to deal with her; you’re sorry Sister feels that way.But that’s her choice.
As to the larger point, I feel like I’ve addressed this before from a different angle, but everyone in these situations at these times has to make and remember the distinction between “more convenient” and “more important.”For themselves, for their sanity, for the sake of others’ feelings: there is “more convenient,” and there is “more important.”
This is my first holiday season in a position like yours, and it’s not really the same — I get along with my parents, my brother’s in-laws yell a lot but have excellent comic timing about it, we all live close to one another, and most importantly, nobody involved reads “no kids” as “no life.””Different,” yes.”Better able to move about unfettered,” oh yes.But Mr. S has a baby, and everyone kind of goes where the baby is because…that’s how that goes.If the S family moves to a big old house in western PA, that’s where the baby is, so…that’s where we’ll go, because traveling with a child or children and all their bottles and binkies and blankies and board books, and amusing them on flights, and trying to change them in the airport lounge, and keeping them from getting carsick (or…not) — if you don’t have to do it, you don’t do it.I wouldn’t.So I’ll go to the baby — unless I have other plans, which Mr. S will respect, because he doesn’t think that just because I can make the trip more easily than he can means that I have to, or that I have nothing better to do.
It’s easy to feel taken for granted with that stuff, and to a certain extent, you will be no matter what, because it is in fact more convenient, net, for you to come to them.
The thing is, you can’t change the part where the sibling or siblings with small children dominate the holiday-venue discussion most of the time.But if it’s not actually less inconvenient for you?Don’t go.Make yourself important.If you just don’t want to go next year, then just…don’t go.Make other plans, send your regrets, and feel good about it, and if your family questions the choice, you can tell them, look, I love you guys, but the trip is exhausting, and I have to do it every time — and I understand why that is, but I just can’t this year.And let them respect that, or not.
And they may not, but if you take yourself and your own time for granted, they’ll keep doing it too.You can’t do much about the difference between your sister’s travel needs and yours, but if you feel like nobody appreciates that you go to all this trouble to attend when you don’t even want to, then…give yourself a year off.Everyone wins.
Tags: boys (and girls) cats the fam
@ Grinch: Do you know that your sister’s basement is an undesirable place to stay? If she just got a new, bigger house? My friend’s basement is nice, and comfortable. It’s a walkout and has windows and is bright. The couch pulls out, which obviously isn’t as good as a regular bed, but it’s new and it’s nice so not too bad, and there’s a bathroom down there so her company doesn’t have to compete with the kids and the rest of the family getting ready. I’m guessing maybe not, or you wouldn’t be worried about that arrangement.
My in-laws (before they were officially in-lawed) made me sleep in the basement of their house when I came to visit my husband (then-boyfriend). Aside from that it got a bit colder down there than I think they thought it did at night, it wasn’t that big of a deal.
Also, if I had a brand new bigger house, I would probably have gotten brand new better furniture for it, and I might not want a dog to be all over it if I didn’t have a pet myself. The older furniture might be what they have in the basement, and they feel more comfortable with pets being on that furniture?
We spent thousands of dollars carpeting our house and my bil’s girlfriend brings her little dog over like two days later and it peed on the floor. The end of the world? No, but it did feel like “Can’t I ever have anything be nice?”
Another thing to consider is that the nieces/nephews/cousins might be afraid of dogs? (Heck, maybe the BIL is afraid of dogs and was just trying to cover with the ‘house is too small reason’ before.) When we go over to almost anyone’s house, they have to put their dog in the garage, gated into a room or two, basement, outside, etc., depending, because my oldest is sort of scared of dogs. My son has a friend who is terrified of dogs, like paralyzing fear, and the hassle of carrying around a 50 pound kid clinging to you for dear life or that perches on the counter and won’t come down and asks “Where’s the dog? Where’s the dog?” over and over and over versus having the dog hang in the basement kind of makes sense. to me. Assuming we’re talking about a finished, modern, suburban basement and not the dirt floor underground cave of a 100-year-old home…
OK, I feel really stupid here, but I have absolutely no idea what “Cut the rebop” means. It sounds cool and I would like to use it appropriately so can someone tell me what it means, please?
Wow, thanks for the comments, y’all. To answer a few questions:
Yeah, I’m pretty confident these were date requests. Well, actually, I’m very confident about the first, and then second-guessed myself about the second, thinking maybe I was just skittish since I just had been asked out, which confusion was part of my problem.
I mean, my inability to read some social cues and respond appropriately is part of my question, so it’s a fair question whether I’m just misreading these situations, but… I make new friends fairly often, and of course I have lots of close friendships and lots of not-close-but-enjoy-hanging-out friendships with men (as does my boyfriend with women), and I’m not reading flirtations into those that don’t exist. These situations read as different to me, which is why I felt confused about how to respond.
On not mentioning my boyfriend:
This is interesting and I want to think more about it. My first impulse is that it really depends what we’re talking about. Music? Yeah, I’m gonna mention my boyfriend, because he’s the main way I discover good bands. But, I don’t know if this is unusual in a relationship or not, but big chunks of our interests are not that shared and are things we experience pretty independently of one another. So if that’s what I’m discussing with someone, he might not come up.
All of the experiences I’ve had in the past several years where I felt like I was being asked out by someone who didn’t know about my boyfriend were people I met at school, and we’d mostly talked about school stuff. It’s a little bit unusual to find women with my intellectual interests — not THAT unusual, but I’ve been part of a very small minority in a lot of classes, so that’s part of the context for school settings producing romantic interest, I think.
My boyfriend and I did split up for a little bit, and in that time I felt like I saw HOW MUCH I talk about him… when it suddenly became weird or inappropriate to do so, I felt like I lost half my stories. But I guess it’s all context.
As an answer for all those looking to indicate that a date is being requested – my now-husband was very specific when asking me out on our first date by stating that he would love to take me out to dinner. I thought that made it very clear that it was not meant to be platonic. “Meeting” for dinner is much friendier than “being taken to” dinner.
Can we start a support group for People Afraid Their Home Smells Like Cat Pee? Because I would so join. Except in my house, my olifactory (is that the right word? I’m too lazy to check) senses are dulled, but not quite dulled enough to the fact that we DO have some issues (partly because the most beloved of my 3 cats is now in kidney failure, and as such feels that he should get to pee anywhere he wants to. I don’t mean to sound harsh – I love him, he’s putting me in serious debt at the vet, and I clean up the mess and deal with it. But it ain’t helping the smell issue). I also don’t have great air ventilation (can’t wait to move – that’s a different story).
I feel better knowing I’m not the only one who obsesses about this – I’m not a crazy cat lady (by myself, hee). :)
@Grinch .. as a dogs-instead-of-kids person myself, I feel your pain. I’m lucky to have a local and dog-friendly family, but I know if I was told I couldn’t bring my dogs with, I’d have second thoughts about going myself. I wouldn’t dream of kenneling my babies! But.. I have to ask, just because it wasn’t mentioned.. what condition is the basement? Some finished basements are very homey and nice, and having your dog locked down there could give you an excuse to seek a little reprieve from the overwhelming in-laws too.. “Sorry, can’t join in this round of watch-the-kids-scream.. gotta check on the pup.”
Good point about kids being afraid of dogs. A lot of kids haven’t been around them, or got knocked down by a well-meaning one once and are now terrified of them, but that could be the issue.
@Shonda: It…isn’t really cool, but you can find the answer in the Jump Street recap on the homepage. Captain Jenko says it to stop an argument between Hanson and Penhall; the basic gist is “knock it off with the jawboning.”
The temperament of the dog in question is also part of the equation – I have a 65lb Doberman and two <20lb Boston Terriers, and I'd take the sweet, mild-mannered Dobie anywhere over the walnut brains any day. They are cute and small, obviously, but oh em GEE, the rebop. It would need cut constantly.
I would totally, absolutely understand if it was an issue of dog fear (or sickness), but my niece and nephew adore my dog (she and nephew “write” letters back and forth), and she adores them.
Basement condition: it’s finished, yes, and there’s a pull-out couch. But a) it’s their tv room and kid playroom, meaning no privacy or escape for me if I need one; b) it’s cold; c) I’m 6 feet tall, and the duct work hanging from the basement ceiling is…maybe 6’1″ off the ground. Not exaggerating–I’ve hit my head simply walking around. Obvs I’d be lying down if I was sleeping, but still.
I’m in a slightly similar situation as Grinch, though with better alternatives. I got married this year, and my husband is the second of 4 boys. He’s the only married son and the only son who does not live in the immediate area of his family, so we had a ton of pressure on us to come home for Christmas. I wanted to spend Christmas just the two of us, since we’ve never spent it together in the 7 years we’ve been together.
Since I just started a new job, I have virtually no time off. The compromise we came up with is that my husband told my MIL that we can’t make it down due to my new job, but we are going to drive down Christmas eve after I get off work and surprise her, then drive home on the afternoon of Christmas day. My FIL knows and is helping keep the secret (He’s more amenable to the idea of use having our own lives). The plan is that she will be so happy to see my husband that we won’t get much crap for only staying a day or so. On the plus side, our dogs are completely welcome at their house.
I’m not completely happy – I’d rather not go anywhere at all, but I’ll get over it this year and start planning next year’s ski trip (or maybe a tropical vacation) so it coincides with the holidays and let everyone know in July that Christmas will be spent elsewhere.
@Grinch I was also wondering if your sister’s family had met your dog or not. It could be that if you brought the dog and they all met (assuming your dog is kid friendly–or at least not kid-nervous–and well mannered), they’d find they like the dog and want to have it upstairs to play with. Now, if the kids aren’t pet socialized, you might have to keep an eye on both for a bit (no tail pulling, lets give the dog a break). But some dogs are “naturals” with kids and don’t mind being rolled on for hours by little ones. You might be “promoted” to the guest room if they realize the dog is not going to maul their house. Or they might pull the dogs ears and you’ll want to keep your dog in the basement to protect it from maurading children…I don’t know.
Oh, and @Bria, it’s because I’m actually going to be gone for about 2.5 weeks over the holidays. If it was just a few days she’d absolutely stay with the petsitter.
I’m pretty sure “cut the rebop” was originally from A Streetcar Named Desire.
I’m a “no dogs in the house ever” person, but I do understand that arrangements have to made for them. The question that I keep thinking is whether it’s a nice regular room type of basement or just a storage place. Most of the basements I’ve been in are fully rooms, usually play rooms, but with a couch and tv. If it’s a bare bones storage room and you’d end up on an air mattress type of basement then I see that it wouldn’t be a good option. Otherwise is being banished to the basement just being sent to a room on a lower level?
@Grinch: If your dog has stranger issues, she may actually be happier at the kennel.
My BF’s folks have given my dog (a rescue with some issues of his own) a standing invitation to come with us when we visit, but if there’s going to be a crowd I’ll either leave him home and skip out early, or board him. Especially if there are going to be babies or other dogs there. I’m pretty sure that boarding is less stressful to him than riding in the car and staying at a strange house (judging by his eating and sleeping patterns, and his smell… laugh if you want, but I swear that he smells different when he’s stressed). So it’s really for my own sake when I do bring him along.
Obviously, that’s specific to my dog; I know that some dogs would freak out more about being boarded. But I don’t think that there is a huge difference in a dog’s mind between boarded for one night or two. If you can’t afford it, you can’t afford it, but I like the suggestion that sis should chip in if she thinks that you leaving early would “spoil Christmas”.
Oh, and I am so jealous that you have a kennel that will let you pick up your dog on a holiday. I’ve never found one that will!
I’d just like to add that while some people are all “I have children and the world must bend to make way for them”; as Sars said, there are things that are just more convenient. (And I will say, Grinch, your sister does not sound like one of these terrible people, and you’ve also got a dependent to worry about). It’s not done to diminish others, but it is often easier when you have kids for people to come to you, and sometimes you can’t stay out that late, and sometimes your kids cry on planes. And I think the Single and Childless (of which I am a member) need to remember that. People with children are not Out. To. Ruin. Our. Lives. They’re just trying to get by.
@Alison “On a similar note, how would one go about asking someone for dinner or coffee and make it obvious it IS romantic?”
You’d say “I think you are fantastic. Can we go OUT ON A DATE sometime?” I’ve asked guys out and saying the “date” word does make you feel vulnerable, because then he knows you feel all marshmallowy about him and that may give him an advantage, but it’s a chance you take. And OMG, guys are delighted to be asked! (Guys? Kudos to you for working up the nerve to ask us out all these centuries. Thought I’d barf the first couple of times I did it.)
(And sorry, Cyntada. It helps it go away if you make up your own lyrics, heavy on the cussing.)
No (shoulda picked a better name): you are not the only one who mistakes dates for platonic invitations. I do this constantly, and I by no means have autism/Asperger’s to blame it on. Nor do I have a convenient boyfriend to cite when what I think is a platonic good time suddenly gets gropey. Ugh. Girls may tend to assume that a guy is platonic, but we probably shouldn’t.
At this point I pretty much assume that a single guy (i.e. not married or conspicuously coupled) asking to do something with me IS a date, period. Because odds are ridiculously high that that’s what it is.
And yeah, if you’re talking to a single guy, you probably do need to drop the boyfriend bomb into the conversation pretty early on.
Guys? Kudos to you for working up the nerve to ask us out all these centuries. Thought I’d barf the first couple of times I did it.
This is one advantage of an all-girl education; I had no choice. I would not exactly call it enjoyable now, but at least I developed a callus to some extent.
Just to clarify a little (and sorry, Sars, for horking your comments) my question really isn’t whether I should be allowed to bring the dog to my sister’s. I wish I could, but I can’t for what I’m sure they believe to be good reasons, and that’s that. The question is whether I’m being a freak for only staying one night on account of the dog being kenneled and other assorted stressors.
Grinch, thanks for chiming in regularly! (No too.)
In regards to your sister’s objections/meltdown over your plans, I think what’s happening is everyone’s rebop needs a good trim. As you pointed out, you have a family member in Dog, you have a long car trip (FIFTEEN HOURS?? Dear God, there are very few people I love THAT much) and a basement ceiling waiting to festoon your head with lumps.
But your sister has a huge new house full of sugared children and various -laws, and a huge pressure to have a giant multi-day house party at which she is doing the lion’s share of cooking, cleaning, and entertaining go off PERFECTLY because it’s the HOLIDAYS and if everything is not just PERFECT the holidays will be ruined and it will be ALL HER FAULT FOREVER! (And if she’s also working outside the home, well, pile that right on there!)
Her stress level is probably so through the ceiling that she didn’t read your arrangements as the thoughtful setup they are, but as some kind of screwed up commentary about how she’s handling this giant unwieldy task, and thus her reaction is far more about how what she thinks you think of her than what you’re actually trying to do (if that makes sense.)
So here’s a suggestion. Buy her a really nice (not necessarily costly, but nice) personal gift. Not something for the house, for her, and write her a note saying something along the lines of “I don’t say this enough, but I can’t express how grateful I am about the gargantuan effort you put in at this time of year. I can’t imagine how you do it, and this is a far too small token of my appreciation.”
I’m not saying it will magically melt all holiday stress and dewarp everything about your relationship, but making her feel heard might go a long way in soothing feelings, and make any rifts about future divergent holiday plans a lot smaller, at least between you two.
Wow, there’s a lot of us childless maiden aunts here. I’m lucky in that I don’t live that far away from my parents (most of my family lives in the area actually, very few of us ever leave Massachusetts) and they’re willing to come fetch me. I don’t own a car and they’re nice enough to not want to subject me to mass transit, since I always have to work on Christmas Eve my dad will pick me up and then we go directly to the big family party at my aunt’s house. Christmas Day is just me and my parents and the day after Christmas we go to my brother’s house to see the nephews (two human and one canine.) That way the kids and their parents can have the actual day to themselves and my parents and I don’t have to travel on Christmas Day, and our day is much mellower as a result.
I get the feeling that I should resent being the one to always have to travel, but since it’s really not that far and I love seeing the nephews I don’t. The fact that my parents have never pressured me about it and understand that it’s extra work for me helps. My sister-in-law’s mother, on the other hand, once successfully guilted my sister-in-law into traveling on the Mass Pike IN A BLIZZARD on Christmas Day because she feels that, spouses or no spouses, dammit her kids have to be with her on Christmas Day! Thank God my parents are so low-key.
@Bria: Correct. Blanche is dithering about something or other and Stanley yells at her to cut the rebop.
Chiming in on the “is it a date or not” discussion:
Back before my current relationship, I’ll admit that I could rarely muster the self-esteem to assume it was a date if a guy asked to spend time with me or “hang out sometime.” So unless it is setting off significant and loud “date” alarm bells (something expensive, flowers are involved, horse-drawn carriage rides), I just agree to hang out sometime and see if he behaves differently than a friend would. I’ll often suggest a more “friendly” activity if asked, like going to the batting cages/bowling/watching a sporting event live or on TV, vs. the awkward coffee/dinner date. Generally that will sort out the guys who want to “hang out” and those who want to date you. Passive, yes, but I’ve been over the moon about too many guys who only wanted to be “friends,” to make any more romantic assumptions.
And as others have said, your boyfriend will naturally come up in conversation at some point casually, so I wouldn’t worry too much.
Grinch, please tell me that, sans your pupper, that your sister isn’t going to STILL keep you in the basement, is she? With an empty bedroom upstairs?
And since you are fiscally challenged, as many of us are, NO GUILT if you don’t happen to go out and get an extra-special present, TOO. On top of whatever you may have already planned to bring. On top of kennel/sitter’s fees. On top of FIFTEEN HOURS’ WORTH OF GAS, EACH WAY.
@Jeanne – a LOT of us childless maiden aunts! I’m really lucky that one of my sibs will often come and get me (… if the car is working!), which is a real kindness to a carless sister, and I’m so happy for my brother and SIL and their lovely son (plus the work-in-progress), but I consider myself equally lucky that they all understand that sometimes holiday traveling is just not going to happen for me, and that I need the time to myself to recover from the rest of the year.
@ Jen S, that is an excellent and generous idea. I do generally try to convey this by being extra-active with helping out with the cooking, dish-washing, kid management, etc so she can handle her in-laws and stuff, but that really runs more to invisible support rather than active acknowledgment.
Jen S that’s a really nice simmarary. You have excellent empathy skills I think we need to nominate you as the Deanna Troi of Tomato Nation!
Grinch, you’re making a huge effort to be with these people, if they’re going demand more from you by insisting that you stay longer, they have to learn that life’s hard, buy a helmet. Or pay for a private jet to fly you there and back.
I get hung up on the friend/dating “Let’s go out sometime” thing, too. Especially since I’ve reconnected with so many old friends from high school. I’m never sure if the men are saying “Let’s hang out” in a platonic way or if they’re looking at my pictures on Facebook and thinking, “Oh baby, I’d like a shot at that!” Anyway, one of these said friends who I’ve reconnected with and had lunch with before (he was looking for work, I introduced him to a recruiter), ended up texting me and asking if I’d like to go to dinner sometime or for drinks. Having feared he was “interested” (based on some texts proclaiming how “stunning” my eyes were), I said something like, “Sure, I’d like to go out as friends.” I don’t know if that was the most tactful way to say it or not but I felt it had to be said…just in case. If they ARE interested, you’ve let them know you are not. If they are NOT interested, the two of you can laugh about it later. “Haha, you thought I was asking you out? You big silly!”
@Grinch: I think she is partly redirecting the anger she feels towards her husband on the “no pet inside the house proper” (or even the having a million relatives to deal with) on you because it’s probably easier to do.
I second the personal small gift, and I would just have a frank conversation with her about the issue in person if she manages to have any time to herself (or maybe address it in a phone call later on, when she is less stressed). Something along the lines of “I thought to myself that kenneling dog overnight and leaving the next day would be the best way not to make a big deal out of the issue, and the fact that my funds are very limited this year, but I realize now that it might have come across as my not appreciating how you open up your home every year. I realize how stressful that is for you, and I was trying to reduce your stress, and not add to it, honest. I really do appreciate all that you do, and I really do wish things could have worked out differently.”
Perhaps that might even spur her to put her foot down with husband next year and say “Look, our kids adore Dog, and my sister would stay over longer if she was able to bring Dog and not be banished to the basement as a result. I really would like to see my sister for more than a few hours this year. Can’t that just be my Christmas present this year?”
Thanks to Bria and Sarah for the source of “cut the rebop”; who knew that 21JS was capable of such heights of allusion? But I can’t help feeling some of the fun is gone, now that I know it’s less rando, more Brando.
@Soylent Green: just so you know, I’m stealing “Life’s hard, buy a helmet.”
Grinch: I agree with the others who’ve speculated that your sister is going for the perfect 1st Christmas in her new house. And it seems like her perfect first Christmas includes everybody being there. With that in mind, it seems like she’s focused on building the memory of the holiday, so that she can remember it as “…and EVERYONE was there!”
With that in mind, I also agree with those who suggest a small personal gift Your presence this particular year is probably the most awesome gift you could give her — whatever you bring to stick under the tree is just the cherry on top, really. Next year, when the newness of the house has worn off a bit, you might be able to reconsider your holiday plans and just see the fam over New Year’s, which seems more convenient for you in terms of Dog arrangements.
“along the lines of “I thought to myself that kenneling dog overnight and leaving the next day would be the best way not to make a big deal out of the issue, and the fact that my funds are very limited this year, but I realize now that it might have come across as my not appreciating how you open up your home every year. I realize how stressful that is for you, and I was trying to reduce your stress, and not add to it, honest.”
I agree with this. Her understanding that you are doing it to help make her life less stressful and that you aren’t doing it in a huff or as some kind of resentment that you didn’t get things the way you wanted them would ensure that everything is on the table. Siblings tend to have conversations inside conversations all the time (me and mine especially) and so much of the time neither side is aware of the inner convo the other one is having.
Also, I get where Jen S is coming from, but I think Grinch being there and being awesome with the helping out is gift enough. As the maiden aunt in my family, my siblings understand expense, hassle, and the vacation time I use to come visit them and they think that is gift enough as well. Grinch expressing to sister appreciation should really be enough and the mention that an additional day of boarding isn’t happening. Seems like a gift would just be adding to the strain. Just my opinion.
PS- can I gripe about the crazy high prices I spent boarding my two dogs here since so many others will understand my pain? I only get home once a year, so I go for around ten days (plus two for travel by plane and car) which, where I live, is costing me right at $800 for boarding. It’d be half as much to bring my dogs with me, but I just can’t subject them to all my nieces and nephews. They would not deal well with it. Next year’s visit is going to be much shorter.
Oh holiday drama.
This year I had the fun of my dad obliviously wanting my sister and I to spend to holiday at his girlfriend’s house, even though we both have issues about this woman making my dad take down all the pictures of our dead mother in his house.
I am avoiding the issue by being out of the country, though I waffle between telling my dad why it is that I’m arranging to be out of town so that he knows his actions have consequences and just removing myself from the situation with minimal drama.
@ Grinch: As the Sister in my particular family’s make-up, I hope you don’t mind if I play devil’s advocate. First, I agree with everyone who has mentioned that your sister is probably feeling a lot of pressure having to host Christmas in her home. As the only one with children in my family, believe me, it is a double-edged sword to play hostess, especially to in-laws, who – let’s face it – are not the same as MY family. I appreciate not having to travel, but hosting has its own set of stresses. If you find your sister’s in-laws irritating for one day, at least you can go home and forget about them. For her, it is not so easy. And I can see how your dog would be just One More Thing to deal with, you know?
That being said, I can understand why your sister would be hurt and angry that you want to leave after one day, especially considering how long the trip to get there is – and how probably infrequently she sees you as a result. We recently had a huge shindig in our home that in-laws and my family both attended. I had hoped that my sister would stay for a while so that we could catch up outside the hoopla and also so that there would be at least one person with whom I didn’t have to be “on†the entire time, who could be the fun aunt to help with the kids and help me out with hosting duties. Instead, she came just in time for the party and left before it was over. Not only was this very hurtful to me, it was also embarrassing to have to explain her behavior to the in-laws. Rightly or wrongly, I saw it as a reflection on me and my relationship with my only sister that she would behave in this manner. I know that you think you have a good reason for it – yes, your dog is your family too – just as I’m sure my sister had her reasons for behaving as she did, but this is how it looked to me and my in-laws.
Re: your immediate situation, I’m curious why your dog is an issue this year in particular. What have you done in years past when her place was too small to accommodate him? I’m getting the sense that, since you think she CAN house him, she should, so I can see where the scenario where you leave early to be with him can be construed as a way of punishing her. Could you perhaps kennel your dog for the first night as you plan and then get him Christmas day and have him stay in the basement? Also, I know it is a little insulting that she said you “can†stay in the basement with him, but that’s a lot different than you HAVE to. I took that as her saying that your dog wouldn’t have to be all alone if you didn’t want him to be, but that you would be welcome to the guest room if you so desired.
I’m not saying that you are wrong to feel as you do, but I just wanted to present a different perspective. And, if your relationship with your sister is anything like mine, she KNOWS how you feel about traveling to spend the holidays with her and her family, and honestly, that’s just another source of hurt, stress, and anger.
Actually, I believe “cut the rebop” was first used in Hamlet.
@Shonda:
Professor Google says that rebop was a form of jazz that many people found unpleasant to listen to. So it’s sort of like “Quit your yammering.”
Grinch — being the “maiden aunt” for more than 20 years now, I’ve got to say that you are not being unreasonable. If I’ve correlated the logistics correctly, you’ll be traveling 12 hours, staying with your parents (?), then another 3 to your sisters on Christmas Eve. Then back to your parents to pick up the dog. It sounds like you’ll be staying with or near your parents and seeing your sister again for a few days around New Year’s before heading back the 12 hours to where you live. It sounds like the dog will only be staying one night in a kennel but won’t be home for a couple of weeks.
If this will be the family situation for any length of time, you have to get your sister used to the idea that you have needs too. And that you aren’t an accessory.
No (shoulda picked a better name): First, if I’m interested, you hinting about having a boyfriend probably won’t stand in the way of me asking you out. Second, I assure you, if I were to ask you out, you would have absolutely no doubt what I had in mind.
“What I’m saying is — and this is not a come-on in any way, shape, or form — is that men and women can’t be friends because the sex part always gets in the way.”
Grinch, I don’t know what’s up with your sister. But even if the speculative comments above are in the ballpark and she’s got some hostess perfectionism thing going on, it still isn’t your job to make her perfect holiday fantasies come true. You really do get to act in your own best interests, even if your interests conflict with her vision of the holiday. And you don’t owe her an apology (or an extra present) for doing what’s best for you.
Wow, it’s so nice to know other people have holiday travel issues, too. It seem like everyone I know only ever deals with one side of the family at a time, so no one knows the pain of juggling two different families for EVERY holiday. Of course, my husband and I live within 15-20 minutes of both sides of our families, so everyone expects us to be at everything every year. And we have a baby as well. So while the actual traveling isn’t much, the back and forth ALL DAY LONG every Christmas, Easter, etc. is a pain. And it makes trying to keep any sort of nap schedule difficult. Sars, I have to say I love your “everyone goes to the baby” attitude. I wish my family shared that. This year my parents will not be going anywhere on Christmas Day, instead telling me that we can come over to their house whenever we want. Gee, thanks. Since they pitched a fit when I asked them to come to us last year, it’s not worth the fight again. I dream of the day when we can move away and have our own holidays without all the back and forth.
So, even as someone with a child, I don’t think you’re being unreasonable, Grinch. I have a dog as well and boarding is expensive. I could understand your sister’s upset a little more if this was going to be your only opportunity to see her anytime in the near future, but you said you’re going to see her around New Year’s. Hosting is very stressful, so I’m guessing her emotional response came as much from the stress as from her wanting you to stay longer.
@Jae
Perhaps the reason your sister left so early is in your reason for wishing her to be there- you said you would like her to help out with your kids and with the in-laws. You wanted her to be there for you to help with the elements of your life that would be at the party. But she has her own life. Maybe that isn’t how she wanted to spend the holiday. And maybe that isn’t what she considers spending quality time with you.
I’m not sure what you would have had to explain to your in-laws anyway. I can’t see anything wrong with her behavior.
@No (I should have picked a better name):
I think it can get particularly messy when people frame date requests to mitigate possible rejection — that is, by trying to pitch the outing as platonic sounding as possible, so if if doesn’t go well, they can always say, “Well, I never said it was a date in the first place…” I mean, I have trouble reading the signals, too, and I suspect that has a bunch to do with it. (Then again, I’ve even had trouble when I make a point to say that I do not want an outing to be a date, as I’ve had folks who have told me that they thought I really didn’t mean that I wanted the outing to be platonic. So, hrm.)
Lots of people have given advice already but just to throw two cents in/rant a bit. Had a similar discussion last night with the BF. We have dinner with his mother tonight, before trekking to PA tomorrow for my parents, which is a repeat of what thanksgiving was like. The whole thing is freaking exhausting, and frankly, we just bought a house and we’d like to actually be able to spend a holiday in it now instead of rushing around to meet everyone else. But what can we do? As I pointed out to him when he declared that we can’t do the double holiday anymore- “are you really going to tell your mother, who lives less than 40 minutes away, that you can’t have dinner with her on the 23rd because you’re going to my parents on the 24th and it would just be “too muchâ€? You’re really going to tell your mother you don’t feel like seeing her?” and the answer is, of course, no. She’s alone and would be so hurt to not see us at all for the holiday, even if she understood and sympathized with the situation, and we wouldn’t do that to her. So once again, we’re just gonna suck it up, get in the car and drive and then rest once January comes.
@Elsajeni: “Get thee to a nunn’ry, and cut thou the rebop.”