The Vine: January 11, 2005
Dear Sars,
I am curious to hear your thoughts on my Christmas dilemma.
I will start by giving you some background on all the players. I got married earlier this year to someone whose parents live several states away. We live in the same town as all of my family. My husband and I have known each other for over five years. Last year was the first Christmas we spent together because he was unable to go home.
We are also unable to spend the holidays with his parents again this year. But I realize that next Christmas will be spent at their house, and probably alternating years after that.
My problem comes from my allergies. I have issues with most scented candles and especially with holiday-type scents. A few years ago I realized that I am allergic to the real Christmas trees. First I have the sneezing, and burning and itchy eyes, and then after a while breathing in general is unpleasant. So, we always get a fake one. My family has always had a fake one, and I never thought anything of it.
His parents have always had a real tree. His mother also loves scented everything. Last time I was there I was having reactions to her normal candles and potpourri. But I feel so bad asking her to put them away. Then they look at me all weird when I have ten sneezes in a row. I realize I am to blame for not asking her to remove them, and that she might not realize what will or will not cause a reaction.
I would like very much for them to use a fake tree if I come up for the holidays, but I feel guilty asking them to spend the money on that just for me. But on the other hand, I would be miserable if I had an allergic reaction the whole time. I usually just take regular over-the-counter stuff for my allergies, but still pine and cinnamon bother me. I’m also tempted to just buy a tree on sale the day after Christmas and ship it to them. I don’t know. Maybe now that I’m a part of the family it is not too much to ask them to switch to a fake tree for the times that I visit? I realize that this is a silly problem, but I just wanted to hear your take on it.
Thanks,
Give me a fake, pre-lit tree any day
Dear I Love Those Crazy Fifties Pink Ones,
You can always ask — or have your husband ask — if your in-laws would mind having an artificial tree the years you come to visit. You’ll even split the cost with them, go to Target, pick it out, whatever makes things easier for them. Or they could do two trees — the fake one, and a real one, maybe on their porch if they have one, or somewhere else out of the way where it doesn’t bother you.
If they’re not hot on that idea, well, you’ve made your reasons clear, so find a nearby hotel and get a room there for the holiday so that at least you can escape from the allergens when you want to sleep, or any other time you’ve got the sneezes.
Some people really balk at a fake tree, but see if you can’t get your husband to ease them into it, like this coming November, and if it’s no go, make other arrangements.
Hi Sars!
Love the site; hope you can help. This story is kind of long and
convoluted
(aren’t they all)…I’ll try to simplify. I spent four years with a
guy,
married him (very young), one year later got wise to the fact that he
was a
big, crappy, loser dick and left him. Moved on, found myself, life was
great.
Enter J into my life one night through a mutual friend. J was 34 at
the
time and I was 25. J and I started dating, although I was apprehensive
because of the failed marriage, but quickly we became best friends.
Everything was rosy and wonderful, we were the “perfect couple,”
everyone
thought we would be together forever, blah blah. But, due to some
“woman
scorned” bullshit on my part and some stubborn “I like things the way I
do
them” stuff on his part, we broke up. He said, “I’ve been thinking and
I
don’t think that we will end up getting married, so we should just end
it
now.” I was devastated, didn’t know what to do, life was over,
whatever.
We have the same circle of really close friends, so dealing with his
presence several times a week became a necessity. Either that or
moving to
Mars. I dealt, tried to move on, it sucked, whatever. A month or two
passed and he decided he missed me and had made a mistake. We got back
together but two weeks later he broke up with me. Said he really
missed our
friendship and had mistaken it for the romantic stuff and he was sorry.
In
an e-mail! Jerk.
I stayed away for a month or two and we didn’t see each other,
but…eventually I wanted to leave the house again, and having to deal
with
the always at the same place with the same people thing, we ended up
not
really severing the friendship and back in bed together several nights
a
week for about a year. (Seeing a pattern yet?) Still best friends, he
calls me almost every day, we have fun together, intellectual
conversation,
go to movies, dinner, drinks, wonderful sex. But, when I realize a
year has
gone by I start to feel like a big loser, I do want to find a life
partner
and I’m never going to if I’m still attached to J so…I tell him this,
and
in order to make the break for real we should not see each other or
talk for
a while.
Two months later, I get a phone call asking if we can talk.
In
this talk, J says he realized in the absence how much he missed me and
how
big of an ass he’d been and he wouldn’t blame me if I never forgave him
but
he’d been thinking about us and kids and forever and would I give him
one
more chance? I say yes and the beginning of the rest of our lives
starts.
You can’t just make the past go away, though, can you? Everything is
great
for a while, but about a year later he starts getting the itch again
and
becomes distant, et cetera. I know the signs by now and we talk about it.
He
asks me to bear with him, he wants to work through it, keep the lines
of
communication open, he’s just not sure if we’re going to make it the
long
haul and he doesn’t know what to do, blah blah. Eventually, he breaks
up
with me, again, and I’m devastated, again. But more angry this time
and I’m
done with the whole situation. We still have the same places same
people
syndrome, but this time I just decide to ignore him. This scenario is
not
going to happen again!
Several months of uncomfortable sitting at
different
ends of the bar, friends feeling caught in the middle and just all
around
yuckiness ensue.
So, I think I’m mature enough to be able to handle a friendship-only
relationship. The ignoring is making life uncomfortable and I look
like an
idjit to boot. Besides, I am way too wonderful of a person to put up
with
that bullshit and I am never going to let him hurt me again, right? We
go
back to the best friend thing, a little more slowly this time, but it
happens none the less. And, you guessed it, back in bed together.
Good
God, what is wrong with me?
I’ve dated a few other people, he’s dated one other woman in this four
and a
half year history, but we always come back together. I know what I
would
say if this story was coming from a friend of mine, but somehow this
feels
different. We talk all the time, he says it has never been and never
will
be just about sex with us and somehow I believe him. There is more to
it
than a booty call. He calls it “this relationship.” We hang out
together
all the time, have great conversation, great fun, we confide in each
other,
et cetera but I can’t help but feel something is missing. We’re not
officially
dating. There is no commitment. I’m not going to do this for the rest
of
my life. I want a life partner, possibly some children. He likes
things as
they are. I’m not about to give the same old line for the third time
(commitment or nothing…blah blah-that-really-works-but-not-cakes).
But,
obviously I’m not happy with the situation or I wouldn’t be writing.
Sometimes he makes me angry and I want to kick his butt. I don’t want
to be
taken advantage of.
Is it just that I feel like I am settling because
my
girlfriends tell me so? Am I really a moron that can’t see the
situation
for what it is? Is it so awful if I just like the sex and think maybe
this
is just what I need right now? I am so confused. I’m sick of people
telling me I am stupid for “putting up with his crap,” while other
friends
tell me how great J and I are together and how everything will work
itself
out because they’ve never seen two people more suited. That just puts
a
grain of hope into my brain that someday he’ll figure out how wonderful
I am
(he knows I’m wonderful now, but something’s stopping him, right?) and
that
he wants to spend the rest of his life with me and commitment-phobe or
not,
we’ll take the plunge together. Oh my, oh my, what do I do?
Thanks for your help,
I graduated “Summa Cum Lawwwwwd” (as Jenn from The Apprentice would say),
why
am I so dumb?
Dear Don’t Look At Me, I Majored In Staying Up Late,
“I know what I
would
say if this story was coming from a friend of mine, but somehow this
feels
different.” So…what would you say? And how is it different, exactly?
“Well, we…okay, the thing is…it just is, because…” Look, I have had this exact conversation with my friends, I have had this exact conversation with my-self, and before you can deal with this situation constructively you have to realize two things: 1) it is not in fact different, you only think it is because you have more detailed information at your disposal, and 2) using that as an excuse not to give up on something that maybe you should give up on is perfectly natural and doesn’t make you an idiot. In other words, accept that you’re not doing the smartest thing here, and then forgive yourself, because the repetitive cycle of “never again…oops, I’m an asshole” isn’t helping you make good decisions.
Forgiven yourself? Great. Now, unfortunately, it’s time to face some unfortunate facts, to wit: I’m sure he’s lovely. I’m sure he’s great in bed, I’m sure he does care about you, genuinely…I don’t think he’s some sociopath fuckwad who’s using you and smirking about it. Your love isn’t any less real or true based on its not working out. But…dude. It’s not. It’s not working out. He can’t commit. Why? Doesn’t matter. “But –” No. He can’t. You know he can’t. You want it to be different, you keep going back because you think it’s about whether he loves you back, but it isn’t. I think he does, but he’s proven to you with a worthy-of-court-proceedings volume of evidence that it’s not going to go your way, that he can’t stick it, and on top of that, you’ve more or less trained him not to expect any permanent negative consequences for his inability to make up his mind. Again, not that he’s consciously messing with you because of that, but on some level, he knows he doesn’t have to live with a decision either way.
But in the end, he’s still messing with you; the situation is still messing with you. And I think it’s time to stop letting it. You don’t need to make any grand pronouncements to that effect to your friends, you don’t need to be hard on yourself about it; you just have to decide, for yourself, that this confusion and pain is better put behind you, and start trying to do that, the best you can.
Because he’s not coming around. He’s not. I’m sorry. I know it seems sometimes like he can’t resist you and surely it’s going to work out because of that, but…it ain’t. He won’t do the hard thing; you’ll have to. I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again, it doesn’t make me happy to say it again but sometimes it’s just the way of things: love is not always enough. Your boy has a problem sticking it. It’s not wrong not to have accepted that fact before now; you’re a human being and you’re hopeful, and those are good things. But this relationship is not a good thing for you. Leave it in the road.
Hey Sars,
Glad you’re back from assorted December mayhem; we missed you out here.
I have an ex-friend who did something unforgivable a year ago. Details
aren’t important, it was just way over the line, and the ex-friend made
sure to involve a bunch of people from our social circle for maximum
drama
impact. After it all went down, the ex-friend and I got together, I
explained why I was so hurt and shocked and so on, and I said that I
didn’t
know if we’d be hanging out anymore.
We were never really super-close
to
begin with, but one of the reasons I left some room for trying to get
over
it was the ex-friend’s live-in SO, who’s a good person and who I always
liked. But in the end I couldn’t really get over it, and on the
occasions
where the ex-friend and I found each other at the same party, I have
basically had nothing to say, in as non-disruptive a fashion as
possible. I
can’t know, but I think the SO is sensitive enough to understand why I
cut
the ex-friend off, and understands that I don’t bear any
grudge-by-association. The SO is friendly when we run into each other
but
of course it’s a little awkward, as we sort of talk around the
existence of
the ex-friend entirely.
Now, ex-friend’s SO has accepted a promotion out of state. They are
both
moving. A mutual friend tells me that ex-friend and SO are getting some
people together this weekend at a neutral location before they leave,
and
that the SO specifically asked that word be passed on to me.
The question is, is it even plausible to go to the get-together and
congratulate the SO on the big promotion, while having little to say to
the
ex-friend, knowing all the while I may never see either of them again?
Is
that just tacky? Juvenile, possibly? I know that I could be the bigger
person or whatever and go and give them both my best wishes, but to be
suddenly all nicely-nice to the ex-friend would feel pretty fake, after
all
this. I thought of not going to the get-together and just sending the
SO a
short but warm email and maybe even a Bed Bath and Beyond gift
certificate
or something, but I’m being advised by my best friend to “go to the
party
or nothing at all.” And there is something icky about essentially
asking
the SO to condone (if only by silence) any cold shoulder I might offer
the
ex-friend, at their going-away party for god’s sake.
What do you think? I really have regretted not seeing the SO anymore,
but
it’s one of those package-deal situations, and it stinks a lot. Also,
would
it change your thoughts at all if it were the case that I had in fact
once
been really close to the ex-friend? My best friend is having to make
the
same choice as I am, except in that case, there were years of a close
(if
waning near the end) friendship before the drama went down.
Signed,
The cake is tasty but I don’t much care for the icing
Dear Cake,
Your best friend is not in a position to offer you objective counsel here, particularly not when it’s so black and white, so I think you have two choices. You can go to the party, planning to stay only briefly; you wish the SO your best, and you do the same for the ex-friend. Just say “good luck” or “take care” or something neutral. If the likelihood of your seeing these people again is that slim, eating it for five minutes to smooth things over socially is a small price to pay.
I don’t see anything wrong with the note/gift route either, except that SO made a point of inviting you, so you might want to make this last bit of effort even if it’s a tad uncomfortable. Again, after this, that’s basically it.
Dear Sars,
After having my heart reach its highest possible level this year, with
the Red Sox winning the World Series, it recently reached its lowest.
Yes, I was dumped. And no, the Red Sox had nothing to do with it. In
fact, she’s a Red Sox fan.
I was placed in a situation of being told by my girlfriend, after two
months of dating, that she was also seeing someone else, but that she
wanted to still date me. So at that moment, I decided to say okay, for
I was still crazy about her. But after spending a weekend thinking
about it, I decided that the best thing to do was to break away from
the
situation and put the pressure back on her, thinking it was unfair to
have me in the situation that I was. Unfortunately, before I had a
chance to do what I wanted to do, she called me that Monday night and
broke it off with me.
Sars, please give BSD the proper etiquette of what to do in that
situation. Thanks.
Bill Simmons’s Dad (BSD, also standing for “Big Stupid Doofus” right
now)
Dear BSD,
Well, that’ll teach you to date Red Sox fans.
Oh, I’m kidding, people. Close Outlook.
I don’t know who this lady is who thinks she can not only double-dip on The Vine’s own BSD but who then has the cheek to dump him when he was about to dump her, because that “you can’t fire me, I QUIT” situation is one of the most frustrating in the annals of interpersonal relations.
With that said, I don’t think there’s much etiquette involved. I tend to advise people against accepting an “I’m choosing between you and someone else” situation, because I think it sets a bad precedent, it just makes you crazy wondering if you’ll be the choice, blah blah. I mean, you should have her full attention; if you don’t, to hell with her, really.
So, the bad news is that there’s not much you can do in that situation besides: “[snort] All right, then. ‘Good’ luck. [click]”
The good news is that I bet there are a few fetching Vine readers out there who wouldn’t mind making you feel better. Ohhhh reeeeeeeaders?
Dear Sars,
So…there’s this girl.
I guess I should start by saying that my dating experience is about zero. I’ve been doing the internet dating thing for about a year, and I’ve gotten about a dozen dates from there. Some were pleasant and some were not, but none ever went to a second date. Then the most recent girl came along. We had a great time, with good conversation, eye contact, a kiss at the end and (entirely her suggestion) talk about a second date. That was five days ago.
The next afternoon I called and left a quick message, not looking to talk to her, just to let her know that I had a great time and thought that she was great, and to wish her a happy New Year. Over the weekend I called intending to chat with her, but ended up leaving a message. Well, five days later, nothing. Not interested? Busy? I don’t want to make snap judgments, because it’s way too early for that. For one thing, she’s got a trip to Mexico coming up any day now — if she’s not already there, she’s probably super-busy preparing for it like any normal person. Or maybe…yeah. But still, I feel that it’s too soon.
So since I feel like a novice at this whole thing, I asked some friends for advice on what to do next. My best friend and her boyfriend offered what I’ll call Theory Number 1. In this theory, I should never call the girl, ever again, because calling would make me look desperate and needy. This theory says that I need to play the cool cucumber and let her call me.
Okay, sounds like a pretty good theory to me.
But when I brought the same issue up with other friends, their responses were completely different. In fact, they were horrified to think that I would just ignore the girl that way. They offered Theory Number 2. If I call back once and then never again, they said, it makes me look like I give up easily — that I’m throwing in the towel and slinking away like a cat that just fell off the armrest. This theory says that I ought to call again after about a week (after her trip, of course). Not to discuss future dates, but just to chat and let her know I’m still thinking about her. That also sounds like a pretty good theory.
So the question is…is one theory better than the other? More importantly, does it really make a difference? Once you get out of “crazy stalker” territory (ten calls in a day or whatever) is there a right time or way to contact someone? Granted, despite her talk on our date, this girl could end up being a “one and out.” But it seems like handy information to have in the future — I’d hate to start writing dates off right and left because the Girl in Question wasn’t quick enough with the phone.
On the same subject, do you know of any good books out there about dating? Most seem to be written for women about dating men. Most of the “books for men,” meanwhile, ought to be called “How to be a Chipster in Ten Easy Steps,” and offer “tips” that were probably stolen from the pages of Maxim.
Thanks for your insight,
Wish I Had a Clue or Two
Dear Clue,
Second one first: No. I’m sorry, but…there just aren’t any “good” dating books. Some of them do have good insights, but as far as your really absorbing them, that comes from experience.
Now as to whether you should call once more: Again, no. Twice is enough. You’ve already left two messages; packing for a trip is not the equivalent of solitary confinement. Maybe she has a “good” reason for not calling you back, i.e. she has a roommate who forgot to tell her you called, but after a first date, twice should more than do it, and even if there’s a legitimate reason for her not calling, in her position, I’d react to a third call sort of like, “O-kay, I’ll get to it.”
She’d have made time to call you back by now; she hasn’t. End of story, I’m afraid. Maybe she’s already away and hasn’t gotten your messages yet; maybe there’s an explanation and she’ll surface with it; probably not. Proceed under the assumption that she’s not interested.
Tags: boys (and girls) etiquette friendships the fam