The Vine: July 29, 2009
Dear Sars,
My apologies up front for the length of this email and my thanks in advance for any advice you have for me.
I am a 32-year-old female. My brother (let’s call him George) and his now-wife (Amy who is from the States) met here in Not The States about four years ago. They had been together for three years by the time they left here, and married about two months into arriving in the States. (My brother broke the news of their impending wedding a month before the time with a text message to my mom reading “Amy and I are getting married — what do you think?” I shit you not.)
Recently they returned to visit Not The States for a couple of weeks. While they were away, I made a wholly reasonable attempt to stay in contact with them through email and Facebook and their response was mostly twice-monthly five-minute phone calls.
I’m not complaining or justifying; I’m just trying to explain that I guess because of the relative infrequency of our communication, in addition to the lack of being face-to-face, it completely slipped my mind that I don’t really like my brother. I don’t know how I forgot that but maybe (in addition to the previously mentioned reason) subconsciously I just hoped that having lived away from home for a year and having gotten married, that he’d have grown up a little (he’s 28 now). I mean, I love him, he’s my brother, but he is completely self-involved, self-entitled and arrogant and I just don’t like him. There’s no other way to put it, really.
Amy is lovely — we get along well and I consider her a sister and a great friend but George? Not so much a favourite person of mine. When, a few years ago, I realised that it wasn’t required of me to like my brother and that, in fact, (insert moment of glorious epiphany) I didn’t actually like him, I felt hugely relieved. It was enormously freeing for me to not have to feel constantly guilty about the fact that I mostly always wanted to punch him in the face. A lot.
Anyway, back to the visit. Prior to my brother and SIL arriving, I had arranged to take the second week of their visit off work so that I could spend some quality time with them. In retrospect, not the best idea ever. We had all arranged to go to a holiday cottage for five days. However, having spent four days before our departure to the cottage with them, I was done. Done. I don’t like causing drama so I had pretty much been biting my tongue at my brother’s crap for four days straight and I just fucking couldn’t anymore. I don’t deal well with stress or anxiety and by the time we were supposed to leave, I was a fucking wreck. So I quietly told my mom and Amy that something had come up and that I would only be able to join them at the cottage two days later than planned, just so that I could have some time to myself and breathe again.
I didn’t want to tell them what the full deal was because my mom would have overreacted, but Amy does know that I don’t get on with George (I’ve known her for four years — it’s not the sort of thing you can hide for forever) so I did briefly mention to her, when pushed as to the reason for my delayed arrival at the cottage, that I thought it best for everyone if I just keep my distance for a few days, and she said she understood. I also spoke to my dad and he supported me, saying that he thought I was doing the most sensible and sensitive thing I could, given the circumstances.
Later, however, Amy threw a shit-fit of note saying that she really wanted to spend time with me, the very least I could do was make time for them because they were visiting from so far away, she is supposed to be one of my best friends, couldn’t I just suck it up etc. I apologised again to her but didn’t go into detail. I felt wretched and shitty about the whole thing but I couldn’t see a way for me to spend more time with her and George and not explode. Which sounds overly dramatic, I know, but after 15 years of on-and-off therapy and medications (currently on), I know my limitations and I was barely hanging on to a sense of calm and rationality without the added pressure of having to deal with more of someone I don’t like and have a long, complicated history of disliking.
They left about two weeks ago and I still feel goddamned awful about the whole situation. I didn’t spend as much time with Amy as I would have liked, but I also didn’t cause a huge drama by having a massive fall-out with George, which is I’m sure what would have happened had I forced myself to spend more time with him.
I felt like I did the best I could at the time but then why do I also still feel so horrible and guilty? Why does the whole thing play in a continuous loop in my head? They’ll be back to visit again in a year and what if this shit happens all over again? I know I can’t expect George to change — people are who they are — but I don’t want to endanger my friendship with his wife, which I feel would happen if I can’t find some way to be around him without contemplating fratricide. I feel like I am being a complete bitch.
Am I being a complete bitch? What would you have done, Sars? How could I have handled the situation better? And how can I handle it better in the future?
Kind regards,
I Should Have Seen This Coming And Asked Your Advice BEFORE They Arrived
Dear Arrived,
I think we all grow up with the idea that Family Is Family — you love them, you defend them, wherever they are is home, and so on — and as a result, when you just don’t like a family member, it’s difficult to come to terms with it.
It’s also difficult to accept that, sometimes, it just happens; it’s not that either one of you is a bad person, or wrong.It’s not anyone’s fault.So, you probably feel the way you do because, you know, it sucks to dislike a sibling, and also because, if you can find a way in which it’s your fault, you can explain it, and maybe fix it.
The bad news, alas, is that you can’t really fix it.You can continue to do your best to get along with George for short periods when called upon to do so, which you’ve done; you can try not to involve other family members in the drama, which you’ve also done; the good news is that, under the circumstances, you’ve done pretty well, I think.You’ve done your best, and when you couldn’t take it anymore, you excused yourself as graciously as you could from the situation.
But both you and Amy need to do a bit better in acknowledging the facts here, facts you both possess, to wit: 1) you do not enjoy George, and should not plan to spend longer than 48 consecutive hours in his presence in the future; and 2) she is married to George, and cannot reasonably expect to spend unlimited time as a couple with people known to dislike her husband.
You wish the whole family could just get along, so you act like maybe it still can, when it can’t.Amy wishes the two of you could maintain a friendship irrespective of her marriage to your brother, so she acts like that’s possible, which it kind of isn’t.I know you feel shitty about Amy’s reaction, but try not to; she wants everyone to get along, which is understandable, and she’s blaming you for the fact that it’s not happening, which…well, I can understand it, but it’s not fair.You apologized, you didn’t bitch about George — you did what you could.
Next year, set things up so that you don’t have to spend as much unalloyed time with George as you did this time.Schedule work in blocks that you’ll have to come and go to attend to — or just say that’s the case.Make an effort to spend time with Amy just the two of you, outside the cottage, without George, so she feels attended to.If that’s still not enough for her, explain to her gently that you like her a lot and you wish the situation were different, but given that you and your brother butt heads, you hope she’ll realize that you’re doing the best you can to accommodate her.
And try to forgive yourself.
I’ve been having this issue with my boyfriend lately.I don’t know if he’s been doing it more, or if I’m more sensitive lately (I am totally stressed by exams) but we’ve had the same argument three times in the last two-week span and I need to talk about it.
Basically, he belittles my abilities.Not in an emotional-abuser way: he does it in a loving and indulgent way, and he does it selectively.For example, I’m in graduate school, so I can handle a fairly punishing workload and complex information, and he knows this — but it makes him say stuff like, “I don’t expect you to know about things like fixing cars.You’re smart in OTHER ways.”
This past week he has suggested that I shouldn’t take a seminar that meets for four hours at a time — I have mild ADD, and he doesn’t think I’ll be able to focus for that long — and a few months ago, he had a fit about me driving in a snowstorm.Yes, I hate driving in snow, and yes, I have visibly freaked out about it in his presence before.But I had to get to work SOMEHOW, didn’t I?If I FELT capable enough to do it at the time, and if it’s an action that normal people regularly take part in, what’s the problem?
So far this letter is making it sound like he’s just a sexist, but I know for sure that that’s not it, either.I really think that he has made all these judgments about ME, personally, and I think the judgments are the direct result of the fact that over the course of our three-year relationship, he has seen me at vulnerable and insecure moments, and has, like, memorized them and taken them to heart as how I really am, and how I really feel, all the time.
I finally exploded about this a few days ago.I’m looking for work right now, mostly in retail, and was pouting to him about not having much luck.Under the guise of comforting me, he started saying how I really didn’t want to work in retail anyway, because it’s so fast-paced and so much happens at once, and he didn’t think that I really had a realistic idea about what those kind of jobs entailed.
He cheers me on through graduate school, but he doesn’t think I have the wherewithal to succeed at Target?Not to mention that I spent three years working in retail before I met him (employee of the month twice, at that) and two years in fast food before that. And he knows this, but I’m not sure he believes it, if you know what I mean.
I think this is really his problem, not mine.I also think that his clinically-depressed mother is a major part of the equation.I won’t argue that he’s spent one too many nights in the company of a broken-down woman in his life — but I should be able to unload on him once in awhile without him thinking I can’t cope just because she can’t.He doesn’t believe that his being brought up by her has ANY effect on how he relates to me.That’s another story, I guess.
My question is, how do I make him see what this is really about?He’s not a terribly introspective person, and I really think he thinks he’s just being protective and honest.It’s pretty hurtful, though, especially when I’m already feeling insecure.What can I say to him that’s better than “quit acting like this, you’re making me feel bad” (which I’ve already tried)?
More Capable Than She Seems
Dear Cape,
Have you explained why it makes you feel bad?I mean calmly, parsing the sentences for him and pointing out the spots that make you feel condescended to?You say that he’s not introspective, and if he’s really trying to help, he may need you to help him understand why certain things he says make you feel like a child.Some emotional vocabularies do not come to everyone naturally.
On top of that, the central problem is apparently that he doesn’t take you seriously, which I agree is maddening, but let’s look at some of the verbs you use here: “freaking out” about the snowstorm, “pouting” about your job search, that you “exploded” at him.I’m not saying you shouldn’t have emotions or express them to him, but it’s possible that you contribute to this concept he has that you’re fragile — not least by reacting so strongly to these comments he makes.
I’d suggest switching it up by not taking him so seriously when he passes remarks like the not-knowing-about cars thing.That one’s ridiculous; take the piss out of it.”Wow, magical time machine — 1957 sure is neat!”I have had boyfriends tell me that they didn’t want me driving in the snow; these boyfriends were called “Dad,” given an eye-roll, and waved to through the flakes as I backed out of the driveway.I know you love the guy, but you don’t actually have to believe, agree with, or even care about every single thing he thinks about you.
The next time he says something that adds to your insecurity, take a minute before you freak out.Then, either explain to him that the comment is not based in fact (the retail thing); mention that, really, you’re just venting and you’d prefer it if he just listened; or rip off a sarcastic quip and move on.
You’ve got to take yourself a little less seriously, is the idea.Aim the “quit acting like this, you’re making me feel bad” at yourself, and stop basically giving him permission to dictate your self-esteem quite so much.
Hi Sars — I’m a longtime fan of Tomato Nation, and The Vine especially! I now have two questions about a yearly birthday beach weekend that I host, over my birthday.
The weekend is at a cottage owned by my extended family; the house is a bit “rustic” but sleeps 12. This coming summer will be the 5th year of the weekend. Sometimes someone makes a cake, but the feel is overall much more weekend-at-the-beach than continual-birthday-celebration (which is great — I’m excited to see my friends and spend time at the beach!).
My first question is about who to invite. When I first started hosting the weekend, I invited 11 people, a combination of local friends and friends from college who also live within weekend driving distance of the beach, and almost all attended. Over the years, however, most of those friends have gotten married, so I need to invite a smaller number of couples for everyone to still have a bed.
In general I’ve tried to follow the lead of who has attended in the past by inviting those folks first, since they have shown interest in going before. However, this often leaves me with a couple or two over capacity of the house (which gets pretty packed with 12, without a lot of floor space for sleeping bags, etc.).
In addition, I’ve sometimes had friends who have never attended (but who I’ve invited at some point) mention that “maybe this is the year [they’ll] finally be able to make it” before I have extended an invitation, and when I am not planning on doing so.
Can you advise me on how I should plan my invitation list? Is it better to vary year to year among people who have attended, and ignore everyone else? Should I go by who I am closest friends with, who is closest geographically? What about the folks who assume an invitation? New friends vs. old friends? And, could I give invited guests an RSVP deadline and — if there is a way this could be polite — then invite other people some of the first invitees cannot attend? Nobody hosts a similar event, so there’s no chance of me going by who returns this with a similar invitation.
My other question has to do with cooking and helping out in the house during the weekend itself. I feel that since I am hosting, I should generally provide food while we are there (we usually go out for one dinner, and everyone then pays for themselves). However, cooking several meals for 12 people can be a bit overwhelming, both in terms of cost and time. A few times I’ve had close friends offer to take over a breakfast or a lunch, which I always accept after one round of polite, “Oh, I couldn’t ask you do that!”/”But we’d love to!” (These people, of course, are always invited back!)
Is there a way to encourage the group do this, or is that in bad taste because I’m hosting? And if I decide to ask for this kind of help, should I initiate it with the email invitation, or wait until people have arrived?
Thank you so much for taking the time to read this letter. I hope you are able to help!
Sincerely,
Grateful for a day at the beach, but not the planning
Dear Plan,
Make a list of everyone you’d like to invite — everyone you’d like.People who have assumed an invitation should not have done that, and should not go on the list unless you’d planned to invite them already.Ignore the space cap and write everyone down.From there, it’s like a wedding-invitation list; you have to gauge who’s likely to come if invited, which couples get along best with one another, who’s the likeliest to help out in the kitchen.
But it’s your weekend, at your house, for your birthday.Invite the people you want to spend that time with.If some of those people can’t make it, go back to your list and invite others.
As for help with meal planning, yes, I think you should initiate that in the first email.Some people have a horror of that sort of thing, thinking the host should have everything covered and wait for (but not count on) offers of help, but the presence of sleeping bags undercuts the need for rigid formality somewhat, I’d say.You’ve all known each other long enough that I think it’s not unreasonable to pick a couple of meals and ask for volunteers to prepare it.Maybe you want to buy the food for them if they give you an ingredients list; maybe you want them to pack in and handle it themselves.Either way, I expect that your friends have been waiting for you to ask for some years now, so go for it.
Tags: boys (and girls) etiquette friendships the fam
Amy: Not so off-topic, really; Cape thought a contributing factor was her SO’s childhood spent with a Drama Mama, and I can pretty much absolutely guarantee that she is correct. For whatever comfort there is in it, you are not alone in having to deal with the person you care about in that manner. I know that for me, an open acknowledgment between us both that These Are My Issues, Here Are My Buttons is very useful. It wasn’t part of a fight; it was just part of a conversation we had because we both knew that each of us had issues and buttons, and didn’t want the person someone we cared about to be loaded down with baggage that someone else had packed. It also means having disagreements like adults: when one of us is responding to a trigger, if we can, we let the other one know; or the other person says, “That is not what I mean, and that is not what I said.”
And no, it’s NOT easy. It’s especially not easy if someone throws in an “I can’t do ANYTHING right!” into the mix. It does feel as if we have to be careful of what we say – but maybe that’s not a bad thing, after all. Surely if we care for someone, we want to be careful of and with him or her?
Margaret in CO: Oooo, Captain Condescendo! That’s funny, I think my ex fought in his unit!
“I already fix computers, unclog dishwashers, de-leak refrigerators, de-barf rugs when the cat has a moment, magically restore stained clothing, hang shelving, replace door locksets, carry packages that even the UPS guy won’t lift without mechanical help, and so on and so forth, all day long. I do not need another learning curve! Somebody else can fix the damn car!!”
@Cyntada: I find myself wondering how small the font would have to be to turn this great list into an “I do not need another learning curve!” tee shirt from TN Enterprises.
@Cyntada, that’s great stuff right there. I like how you think!
@Sandman, we could put the “I do not need another learning curve!” on the front & the rest on the back, like a concert T that lists all the cities on the tour. I really really want one!
@LaBella “These Are My Issues, Here Are My Buttons” IS very useful. As a joke, I gave sweetie an “owner’s manual” (he’s a gearhead) that listed some, um…let’s call them ‘flaws’…in my design. The fine print stated that “pushing buttons installed by previous drivers will cause system instability and may lead to spontaneous combustion, hazardous explosions and death.” He does not push those buttons, ever. 15 years of awesome! (And there oughtta be an exes unit…Captain Condescendo & Sergeant Stubbornovich & Private Patronizo…stationed on Jupiter, maybe.)
Hee, thanks!
The font wouldn’t have to be as small as you think. I just had Indesign open and it set up nicely in a text box 7.5″ x 8.25″ –– the smallest line was almost 32pt in TImes Roman. Front/back split optional… I think it would work well either way.
I’d like to see “These Are My Issues/Here Are My Buttons” front and back on a shirt with a few blank lines below each, for customizing with a Sharpie.
I know I’m late to the party, and that Cape already showed up to say she’s doing better, but I just have to say that my first reading of her letter threw up some serious red flags. I actually saw her boyfriend’s words as demeaning and subtly controlling, if not outright passive-aggressive. To me it looked like he was trying to keep her more dependent by reminding her of her shortcomings – hoping she’d say, “Golly, you’re right, I can’t do these things, so you’d better help me do it/figure it out for me,” whether her past words/reactions actually meant that or not.
To me, a loving, supportive partner is one who believes totally in the abilities of the other and offers help when asked or simply does things he/she thinks the other may struggle to do. My (now) husband and I have dealt with this – I took over the finances pretty much as soon as we got together because it just wasn’t his thing. If he asked for help with his bills, I would never just say, “You’re good at other things, sweetie.” That’s condescending crap. If he asks for reassurance or vents that he’s not good at some things, I sympathize briefly, remind him of something else he does well (specifics, not just vague “other things,” which can imply that you can’t think of anything) and then move the conversation along.
Cape, thanks for letting us know that you saw the problem and are working through it. I’m very glad my sinister take on the situation wasn’t accurate, though I think in some instances it could be. Any kind of belittling remarks like that put me on the defensive hardcore – no matter what I’ve struggled with in the past, my partner should be my biggest cheerleader and believe the best in me. Good luck going forward!
Thanks, everyone, for the great advice! I will certainly be figuring out a setup that involves asking folks who come to the weekend to cook a meal. I know that will take a lot of pressure off of me and my especially helpful friends, and am glad to hear that it isn’t an unreasonable expectation of guests in this sort of situation.
And, I also appreciate Sars’ and others suggestions regarding the invite list…I know those will come in handy as well. Thanks, all!