The Vine: March 4, 2009
Hi Sars,
About five years ago, when I was younger and not so smart, I went out and got a tattoo on my lower back. (Like everyone else in the world.) Perhaps not surprisingly, I decided I didn’t want the tattoo anymore and about two years ago, I started having laser treatments to remove it. I had seven treatments to the tune of about $2,500.
Long story short, I can’t afford to continue the laser treatments, which hadn’t yet made much of a difference anyway — they just made the tattoo verrrryy slightly lighter and patchy. If I could afford it, I would probably continue the treatments, but I’m searching for a more inexpensive solution to remove the tattoo. That brings me to my question, which I pose to the readers as well.
Have you, or anyone you know, ever used one of those tattoo removal creams with any luck? I’m thinking of Tattoo-Off, Wrecking Balm, TatBGone, things like that. I don’t want to just cover the tattoo up with makeup; I would really like to get rid of it entirely. I’ve tried searching on the internet, but all I seem to find are paid advertisements and fake testimonials. I’m looking for a real live person to tell me that this stuff works, or that I shouldn’t waste my money.
Thank you!
Sadly tattooed
Dear Sad,
I’ve never used one, or heard from anyone who’s used one, but I have to doubt they’ll do much good.A tattoo is permanent because it’s a burn, a scar, that’s then dyed, so a topical cream isn’t going to do much to address that; I think you’d have to look at the contents and see if it’s some sort of modified acid peel — and I wouldn’t even use those without a dermatologist’s say-so.
The readers will no doubt weigh in, but my feeling is, don’t bother with the creams.Ask your dermatologist if any other options exist besides the laser treatments; you may even want to consult with a different derm, looking for one whose practice is really focused on scar and tattoo treatment.
Hey Sars,
I have eight — soon to be nine — nieces and nephews, all of whom I adore. They range in age from 2.5 to 10 (another baby is due any minute now). As an auntie with no kids of my own, I enjoy giving them gifts for their birthdays and Christmas, usually books (these kids all have too many toys as it is).
So far, in six years of active aunthood (some of the nieces and nephews are from my brother’s wife’s previous marriage), I have received one thank-you note, from my six-year-old niece for her most recent birthday presents.
I’m not wrong to wish the kids would write thank-you notes, obviously. So far I haven’t said anything to their parents (two sets: my brother and his wife have five, going on six, kids, and my sister-in-law and my late — other — brother have three). I’m afraid it will seem rude. Would it be okay to send the kids stationery and stamps, or is that
passive-aggressive?
I would be totally happy with a thank-you e-mail, by the way — it doesn’t have to be paper, as far as I’m concerned. And of course, I don’t expect the little ones, who are too young to read, to write thank-you notes.
When I was a kid, I only wrote thank-you notes when my mom insisted on it. I know my SILs and my brother are busy, and I’m sure thank-you notes just aren’t on their radar. What would Sars do?
Thanks,
Miranda
Dear Miranda,
This is always a tough one — you want to speak directly to the problem, because that’s always best, but on the other hand, it’s bad manners to point out the manners failures of others.So, what to do?
I wouldn’t send the stationery; it is kind of passive-aggressive, and also, I suspect the hint will not be taken.So, while it’s perhaps a bit rude of you to do, I would just put it out there to the parents: “Would you guys mind having the kids who are old enough write me a thank-you note or email when they get gifts from me?I really love hearing from them, and also it’ll let me know the gifts got there okay.”
That last part won’t work if you-all live in the same town, or you do the gift-giving in person, so feel free to edit, but — look, I didn’t like writing thank-you notes either, back in the day, and my mother had to harass us to do it, but kids should know that it needs doing whether they feel like it or not, that courtesy is important.You don’t have to get into that with your siblings, but it’s important to you, and you should say so.
But you should say so once, and that’s it.Don’t nag; don’t apologize for it.Mention it, and let it go.
Hi Sars,
I’m a student at an “alternative” high school that emphasizes personal responsibility, trust, etc., which to the majority of students means it’s easy to sneak out and smoke pot. Which, you know, not my thing, but I don’t think I really have the right to judge, so whatever. The teachers at the school and the opportunities it provides to actually learn things are completely worth it, but it’s occasionally frustrating to be seen as an arrogant know-it-all because I am a straight-A, National Merit, math-camp-at-Stanford-and-MIT sort of girl and tend to avoid drugs.
It’s been a long-running struggle for me to gain — not acceptance, because I wouldn’t get it, but acknowledgment as a human with worthwhile talents, from the majority of the people I spend those 8 hours a day with. There’s another school nearby where I do marching band and other nerdy activities, and I have friends there; I’m lonelier than I’d like, but it’s not like I’m completely excluded from any form of social life.
Recently a group of former friends from middle/elementary school who now go to my school have started reaching out to me in some form or another — actually starting conversations, asking me to lunch, things like that. Nothing major, but it’s the closest I’ve been to anyone at my school for three years. And while most of them use pot, it doesn’t appear to be fucking up their lives too much (still varsity athletes, get good grades, have good relationships with the people around them, haven’t totaled their cars yet, unlike several other people I know) so I don’t really have any moral objections.
At least twice, though, I’ve been somewhere with one or more of them, most recently out of school for the permitted hour for lunch, and seen their drug of choice in a compartment or wherever. Which has made me realize how uncomfortable I am with being in the presence of marijuana when I could be implicated, especially when it’s technically during school hours.
I have never been pressured to try it myself, and they know me well enough to not attempt that, nor has anyone actually lit up or anything while in my presence. But…it’s illegal, justly or not, and I have no desire to get myself in trouble because of being in a car with someone.
On the other hand, I rather like these people, and it’s so nice to have even friendly acquaintances around me that I’m having trouble bringing myself to just stop hanging out with them.
So, my question: am I overreacting? Is there a valid reason to stop spending time with them, simply because I saw a little more than I would have liked? And I know that this is all tied up in issues I have with myself and self-image, and feeling unjustly marginalized, and why am I rationalizing for these people if they’ve spent almost three years ignoring me anyway? But I can’t separate myself from that enough to know if the basic issue of being in the presence of marijuana is something to worry about.
Feel free to tell me I’m an idiot,
Ignorance Is Bliss
Dear Iggy,
Yes, you’re overreacting.I won’t tell you there’s no possibility that you could be “implicated” in something, because you never know what’s going to happen in life, but if they’re not toking in your presence, or while you’re driving somewhere with them, and you’re not trying to get through an airport checkpoint with them, it’s just not a big deal.
And if they do light up around you, tell them you’re not comfortable with it.If someone gives you a ride and a joint gets lit in the car, ask them politely if they’d mind waiting until you’re dropped off.And if they stop hanging out with you because of that, then that’s what they do — it isn’t my experience that people tend to act like a Very Special Episode in those situations, and pressure you or act like you’re a freak, but if they do, you’re better off.You weren’t close with these people anyway; I know that’s not the point, but if you’re not okay with their behavior, you’re not.
I do think that you have to get a little more okay with yourself, though.Your letter has a dismissive, uptight tone to it; you say you don’t think you have the right to judge, but what I’m getting is more like “…but I do judge, because I follow all the rules and get straight As, but I’m not doing that well socially, and I resent these stoners for doing something illegal and still achieving, not to mention being popular.”I mean, I certainly wouldn’t call you an “arrogant know-it-all,” but if you talk to them the way you talk about them…it’s just a little imperious.I think you have to form relationships with these people, and react to what they actually say and do, instead of worrying about what they might do, or assuming beforehand that what they do will slag on or exclude you somehow.They’ve reached out to you; be yourself, and bring the defensiveness down a notch.
Tags: etiquette friendships the fam
As a person who would have had a lot in common with Ig. ten years ago, I would like to emphasize what Linda wrote about not mentioning grades/National Merit. I promise that even at a place like a Stanford Math Camp, people don’t choose their friends based on their SAT scores (or even their AP test scores). I remember a guy at a summer program that I attended telling me that he got a 5 on the AP statistics test at least every other day for the first two weeks. Allow me to assure you that I was not swayed by this information (although he did turn out to be a pretty awesome person once he grew out of that habit).
Hi, Igno,
You present an interesting little dilemma with your question. I thought I’d weigh in a little bit as far as the legalities are concerned. Now, before I do– know that I’m not a lawyer and I’m not a police officer. I am someone who’s published a book on law enforcement officers, and have spent a considerable amount of time immersing myself in law enforcement issues and police procedures.
Here’s the skinny: a lot of cities, towns, municipalities and so on have laws on the book dealing with the issue of “acting in concert.” This statute can apply to an individual who is in the immediate vicinity of someone who is either a.) commiting a crime, b.) is intending to commit a crime, or c.) is in possession of an instrument of crime or some sort of outlawed object (gun, hand grenade, WMD) or substance (crack, heroin, etc.) Here’s the deal: if you and your newfound friendlettes are stopped by Sheriff Rosco P. Coltrane on some dark and stormy night, for a broken taillight– expired registration– something stupid, anything really, and the officer smells bud (they’re good at smelling that shit) they have every right to pull you all out of the car and search the vehicle, and the contents of everyone’s pockets.
Now, you may think that your friends will all own up to their own individual use and say that you had nothing to do with anything, that doesn’t mean that Rosco is going to believe it. Also, it’s certainly conceivable that someone could drop a bag of pot under a seat that you happened to be sitting in when the cop flips on his rollers– and then guess who’s up Shit Creek without a doobie?
If you’re with people who you know smoke pot a lot, then you have every reason to assume that pot is on their person, whenever. That means that you are acting in concert. It’s the same principle if I hang out all the time with an nutjob friend of mine who I know always carries an illegal handgun. He’s shown it to me lots of times, he’s always talking about it. So, when he goes and shoots someone and I happen to be there, well, guess what? I’m getting arrested for murder, too– because I was acting in concert, even if I didn’t DO anything. I had a reasonable suspicion to suspect that a crime might be commited and, like it or not, marjiuana use is a crime.
Now, it’s not a crime that the average police officer is going to bend over backwards to bust you for– but, in these hard economic times, a marijuana bust brings in revenue to the department for bullet-proof vests, cute little dog collars for the K-9 units, gay graphics for the DARE vehicles. These are just things you need to be aware of.
I guess, in the end, you really need to ask yourself an important question: are these friends people that I would be willing to get arrested for? Even if you’d never even spend a night in jail, even if it would all get expunged when you aged out of the juvie system– is it really worth it to you? I strongly disagree with Sars that you sound “imperious.” I think you’re a thoughtful young woman with a self-preservation instinct, which is something most people your age do not possess. So think a little more. It can only benefit you in the long run.
Another suggestion for the thank-you notes.
My parents always had to bug us too, but I was observant enough to notice that my parents also received gifts and yet were not sitting down to write the notes with us. I was not meek enough to keep quiet, pointed this out, and heard “We wrote ours another time.” Despite many requests, they never sat down to write notes *with* us. It would have meant a lot to me to have the behavior modeled and to make it a family activity and to make it so that I would not be made to feel so much of a pest for constantly asking “what do I say? Does this sound right?”
To this day I either seem to write notes (a) immediately upon receipt, like within ten minutes or (b) pretty much never. I have a list going back to high school 15 years ago of notes I should get around to.
But I suppose you can’t tell your siblings that because that gets into telling them how to parent. Ugh.
Now I’m starting to wonder if I’m unintentionally rude, so I have a question: are any of the habitual thank you letter writers in Australia? I have always been taught that a personal, specific, ‘thank you’ – whether in person or by phone – are essential, but I had never heard of a requirement for it to be in writing until I read it on the Vine. Am I rude? Or is it cultural?
Ig,
I always like to worst case/best case scenario things.
Worst case: Pretty much what Nathan (and others) have said. You get arrested for someone else’s pot. School policies and drug laws being what they are right now, this could seriously fuck you up. Even if it doesn’t affect your college prospects, do you think you’re going to be hanging out with these people any more afterwards? Really? Because you’re going to be pissed at them because you got arrested, and they’re going to be pissed at you for blaming them because you got arrested. So the friendships will be over, too.
Best case: You never get arrested/in trouble and are just uncomfortable and worried about the previous situation happening. Constantly.
Meh. I’m not seeing a lot of win involved here.
Also, I have to disagree with the whole “Oh, don’t worry so much” thing. Look, if it was your pot and you were into it and willing to make a stand and bla bla bla, I’d say not to worry about it. Live your life. Take your stand. But this isn’t your stand, it’s not your fight, so I think you SHOULD be unwilling to get arrested and/or get in trouble over it. Seriously.
Jo,
I Googled “thank you note etiquette Australia” and came up with these two links.
An event planner says that an old-fashioned, snail mail letter is “simple good manners”:
http://www.australiaentertains.com.au/2007/03/31/what-ever-happened-to-the-thank-you-note/
An Australian man starts a discussion about wedding gift-giving etiquette and says at the end of the comments that he’s “only ever been to one wedding where I actually ended up receiving a thank you card!”: http://ask.metafilter.com/109166/Wedding-etiquette
I don’t know which source is more reflective of Australian culture and/or social mores. These matters are sometimes hard to pin down …
P.S. I was lax about thank-you notes until my late teens, when an out-of-town aunt told my mom during a phone call that she didn’t know if I’d received her Christmas gift, because she hadn’t received a thank-you note from me.
This aunt is not my favorite person — for one thing, I wish she’d complained to me, not my mom — but she taught me to err on the side of formality when questions like this come up. Since then, I’ve sent hand-written thank-yous for gifts from people I don’t see very often and/or for when people go out of their way for me (like inviting me to Thanksgiving dinner in a place where I didn’t know anyone).
I still owe thank-yous for my 40th birthday party, though, and I’ll turn 44 in about a month. I’d better get cracking.
Thank you notes: my parents never forced us to write thank you notes. Just one mom in the family had her kids do it and she was also more than a bit overbearing about other things. If a relative were to tell me that he\she was hurt by my lack of note I would have sent them to that person in the future but since no one ever said that I assume they don’t care. I’d rather not receive a gift at all than have to worry about the person silently stewing because they’re expecting something in return. I think etiquette rules depend largely on context- some people and some families care, others don’t.
The great marijuana debate: i’m totally with you on this one, Sars. Your advice on this topic is nuanced, informed, and realistic.
Oh, what the heck: I sent the thank-you notes (as a present).
My niece has a birthday very close to the next set of gift-giving holidays, so I sent her a nice present for her birthday and then, because the NSOG-GHs are relatively minor (for us), we usually do a small gift, and the notes had horses on them and were personalized with her name.
Was it passive-aggressive? Maybe. But it’s a legitimate gift to give (my mom happens to love getting notecards, and nobody thinks they’re trying to convince her to write more thank-you notes). I have been getting thank you’s ever since, even if they’re not precisely on the cards that I sent.
I’m neither a police officer nor an attorney, but I would advise Iggy to avoid any situation where she knows drugs are on the premises. In my city there was a big to-do when four highschool seniors were arrested on prom night for posession of pot. The owner of the car admitted it was his, so charges were dropped for the other three. All four, however, were excluded from graduation ceremonies – including walking with their class, as the schools in my city have a zero tolerance policy or drugs.
I’m sure there are other students who do not smoke pot. I cannot believe every single student at the schools is a pothead or druggie, so perhaps Iggy just needs to seek out a different group of people to hang with. No one group, or any amount of popularity, is worth jeapordizing your own academic (or criminal) record.
Ig: Zero tolerance rules are political correctness run amok. And just because you are a minor doesn’t mean that offenses that occurred when you are a minor are forgotten once you become an adult. That “record expunged” thing only goes so far, particularly in this electronic age. If you, as an adult, even much later, say when you are 42, decide to become a lawyer, you would have to disclose offenses that happened when you were a minor when you complete your Bar application. And if you don’t disclose, and they find out about it at some point, they can yank your Bar card. If you ever had to file for a government security clearance — if you became a nuclear scientist say, or even just a policy wonk — same thing. Your instincts to be worried are correct. Doesn’t mean you can’t hang out with the fun kids — it just means that you need to thoughtfully consider the risk, and remember that “but I never inhaled” sounds stupid as an excuse when you are an adult.
Sad-
I would get designing a coverup, go to someone amazing and awesome (Mez in Fort Collins, CO for example), and get ‘er done.
If the laser isn’t working, you’re best off covering that baby up with something you do like.
If you really really really want it gone… go hang out in the sun this summer and leave off the sunscreen on that part of your body. It’ll help fade it.
Ig –
Point the first:
I was you six years ago. You’re a smart kid, and you will get into a great college where, glory be, your intelligence level won’t be a threat and you’ll find friends more like yourself. In the meantime, I agree with the suggestion that you not talk about your own smarts too much around the other kids. Nobody likes feeling inferior.
In the meantime, remind yourself that high school isn’t forever. And being a brainy, different type won’t kill you – in my case, lacking some friends and not fitting in as well led me to some great extracurricular activities (go high school newspaper!), as well as to learn how to be funnier, which comes in handy at all ages.
Point the second:
I’m now a law student, and I agree with all of the comments that suggest you can get in serious trouble just for being around illegal drugs. It may be the case that some kids smoke pot and never get in real trouble for it (see: current and previous presidents). But it doesn’t make sense to bear all the risk of serious, long-term consequences when you don’t even smoke. Steer clear – and if that means you spend more Friday nights with your parents or a good book, you’ll be better off.
Igg,
If you want to interact well with people, here is the formula: Do not judge others and quietly remove yourself from people who make you unhappy or uncomfortable.
In the end you will feel good about yourself because you will be respecting the people around you and you will feel good about others because you have chosen to spend time with people you enjoy.
Good luck and remember, you will be surrounded by equally dorky people soon enough in whatever math/science/engineering career you choose!
n
It’s very rare that I disagree with Sars, but I have to on that last one of Iggy’s. I don’t think you’re overreacting at all. Drugs are illegal and you are at the beginning of a life full of promise – a life that could be derailed if you’re arrested or implicated in someone else’s drug habit.
If I were you, I’d distance myself from the users and seek out friends who are more on your level of achievement and promise.
to Ig and the pot debate:
FWIW, I’ve been interviewed by Secret Service more than once for the security clearances of friends and colleagues. I’ve had to answer that “yes, to my knowledge, so-and-so has tried marijuana.” and you know what? They already knew and didn’t care- because it was so far in the past, the candidate had already been honest with them about it, and it wasn’t considered a “current” problem or a “long-term” one.
So yes, doing something illegal or being in the presence of something illegal could hurt you later on. But in my opinion (and feel free to shoot me down if people feel different) it’s unlikely to affect you in the long-term unless it’s a chronic, personal problem. Everyone in the world could spin you a doomsday scenario where someone they knew was caught and punished for life for just being associated with drug users- but that’s the exception, not the rule.
Also- there’s a lot of “the fact remains that it is illegal” going on here. This is a pretty weak argument. Are you advising her to similarly ditch these people for driving above the speed limit? Because if you can ignore the nuances of the drug debate and boil it all down to “currently legal/not legal”, then you’d have to apply that standard to a lot of other things…
Jennifer said “If you really really really want it gone… go hang out in the sun this summer and leave off the sunscreen on that part of your body. It’ll help fade it.”
The sunshine actually darkened most of my tattoo. I think the sun’s effect depends on the colors, as the blue went from a baby blue to an indigo, but the pale purple faded to pinkish. Mine is ancient so maybe the inks are different now, too. Whaddo I know?
Sunburn also caused some sort of crazy evil reaction with the outlines in mine – they swelled up and HURT Just the outline welted up – it’s as though I had a tattoo in braille. It was 3D! Which was sort of cool, but OW!
So this may not work for you. Try a test spot, maybe?
Ig – look, the fact of the matter is that your new friends’ illegal drug use (and it does matter that there is legality involved) bothers you enough to write to an advice column about it. Are you being judgmental? Sure; you’re looking at a situation and judging it. And you have judged that marijuana use or paraphernalia in your presence makes you uncomfortable. That’s it. The fact that it may or may not get you into some trouble either with the law or with the school is secondary; and unlike driving in a car where someone is doing 5 mph over the speed limit, being in a car with drug paraphernalia could land you in jail. Your friends could claim it is yours. The cop could decide he/she doesn’t care whose it is and throw the book at all of you. You could get kicked out of school. Whether or not any of those things are right or likely really isn’t the point. The point is, is hanging out with your newfound friends worth the level of discomfort you are experiencing while doing it? The fact that you wrote here to ask that question suggests to me “no.” Whether you’re being uptight or imperious is irrelevant; you have the right to judge something “not for me” and opt out. Just, you know, don’t get all “you’re doing DRUGS!” when quietly removing yourself from the situation, and I think you’re alright.
And here’s a really late comment that will probably never get read.
Iggy reminds me of me in high school (which was 13 years ago). I went to a high school where most students used pot, and I was extremely uncomfortable with it. I was also uptight, and studious, and was most comfortable when staying within the rules.
But, looking back, I think I had good reason to be uptight. My dad was an alcoholic, and my family had had some minor scrapes with the law. (Plus one major scrape: My dad’s girlfriend once stole a car, but they broke up after that.) I often felt things would unravel completely unless I was constantly in control of things and constantly able to respond to any emergency. And I might have been right.
Iggy mentions people she knows who have totalled cars, which makes me wonder if she has good reason to be uptight too.
I don’t know if I have any advice for Iggy, except that she shouldn’t think there’s something wrong with her just because she hates drugs. I’d go ahead and hang out with those people if you need some company (and everyone does, sometimes). Just avoid anyone who tries to tell you that there’s something wrong with your preferences, because there’s not, and you don’t need any more self-doubt than you already have.
Regarding tattoos:
I know a few people who have used TATTOO ERASE for their tattoos, and it’s worked well. It’s in the UK though, so I’m not sure if that will help you if you’re in the US.
Basically, Tattoo Erase uses a similar machine to a tattoo machine, but instead of ink, it is a solution that bonds itself to the ink and draws it out. Laser smashes the ink, which then breaks up and purges itself through the bloodstream.
A tattoo hides between dermis layers, and the Tattoo Erase system basically draws it up to the top layer, and your skin ends up purging it like it would a splinter.
Their website is: http://www.tattooerase.com
I used to know someone who ran one of their franchises, so saw a lot of people in for the work, and it was really successful. Cheaper than laser, but not by much.