The Vine: May 17, 2005
The construct “I don’t know from” is a Yiddishism.Here’s more from The Jewish Language Resource Website:
“Yiddish and English
Yiddish has had a quite noticeable influence on American English over the last century. The English of Yiddish-speaking immigrants and their children was of course heavily spiced with Yiddish words and phrases, many of which have worked there way into mainstream English. Some of these (e.g., bagel, shmooze, shtick, kosher, kvetch, etc.) remain identifiably ‘Jewish’ (either for phonological or semantic reasons), while many others (e.g., glitch, maven, mishmash, tush, klutz) have quietly merged with the rest of the English lexicon. A number of Yiddish idiomatic constructions have also entered colloquial English, such as the pattern I don’t know from ___ (ikh veys nit fun ___), idioms (such as “From your mouth to God’s ear”), and the dismissive shm-reduplication (Oedipus Shmoedipus: a boy shouldn’t love his mother?). In addition, the English of many Orthodox Jews in America today maintains a number of Yiddish influences at all levels of the grammar.
Thanks!
L
Dear L,
Argh, of course it’s a Yiddishism.They’re going to revoke my Jersey girl card for not knowing that.
Thanks to everyone who wrote in with the answer (for the record, it wasn’t either of the people I’d predicted).
Sars, would you please clear up this web-content issue?
I’ve been asked to look over the content for a massive corporate website,
and I keep coming across one of my pet peeves — bulleted lists that are
treated like paragraphs. For example:
– Something random in a list;
– Some other item here; and
– A final item over here.
Why the semicolons and the period? Doesn’t the “and” seem out of place when
it’s all by itself on the line? I was about to suggest a major overhaul, but
a colleague explained that he’s been taught that this is the appropriate way
to create a bulleted list (according to his Presentations class). This
treatment seems to defeat the purpose of bullets (unless I misunderstand
said purpose)!
Thoughts? Suggestions? Is it worth the fight?
Soma
Dear Soma,
It looks fine to me, because it’s how you’d punctuate the same series of thoughts in sentence form — but I can see your point, as far as that it’s actually in list form, so I suspect that it’s just a matter of preference, i.e. how clearly do you want to distinguish between how lists and sentences look.
Garner, however, thinks the construction above is correct:
“(3) If you begin each item with a lowercase letter, put a semicolon at the end of each item, use and after the next-to-last item, and put a period after the last item; (4) if you begin each item with a capital — by convention, “fragments” are acceptable units here — end each with a period….
In other words, if you write the list as a sentence, you do need to punctuate it as you would a sentence.But if you don’t, you don’t.
In other, facing-page news, Garner tells me that the word “pubes” has two syllables (“/pyoo-beez/”).I’ve always pronounced it “/pyoobs/,” and this revelation irritates me, because it’s a gesture in the direction of correct Latin, but correct Latin has it as “/poo-bays/.”So Garner’s isn’t really right either, but I still feel like I should switch to his pronunciation.Not that I have call to say the word “pubes” that much.
ANYHOW.
Hey Sars,
I am constantly hearing “very unique” or “extremely unique” and I have that fingernails on a blackboard reaction to it.I don’t think “unique” needs a qualifier like “very” or “extremely,” do you?I even heard a local anchorman use the term “very unique” in a commercial touting their presentation of the news.I know I’m going to keep hearing this no matter how much I holler about it and it’s just going to bug me, but am I wrong?
Just sign me,
It’s great to expand your vocabulary, just use the words correctly!
Dear Exactly,
It’s incorrect.What bugs me now is that it’s common knowledge that “very unique” is incorrect…so people will now try to get around it with shit like “totally unique,” thus missing the entire point.
Garner takes a hard line on “unique,” deeming phrases like “extremely unique” and “so unique” “slovenly” and grumbling that our culture tends to avoid absolutes of that type.Without getting into the stricter semantics of “one of a kind,” let’s just say that “unique” is an absolute, and not only does it not need a qualifier; using a qualifier is wrong.Don’t do it.If you simply must goose the adjective, use a synonym that bears goosing.
Sars,
I’ll try to keep this brief.It’s about a guy, of course.We’ll call him Jack.I met Jack briefly a little over a year ago when he was coming through my town on business.And then I moved to the town he lived in shortly thereafter.We are both standup comics.So we got booked in the same show here in town and we got reacquainted.He’s nice, cute and funny. He invited me to his Superbowl party. Although he had a live-in girlfriend. Oh, well.
I went out of town for a week and came back. He called to let me know the party has been cancelled because he doesn’t live there anymore.He meets me for coffee a few days later and tells me that he was actually arrested for domestic violence.According to him, his girlfriend came home and broke up with him.He wanted to talk and she did not. She tried to leave and he grabbed her arm to stay.The police were called by somebody and they took him in because he put his hands on her.Okay, that happened.It’s bad, yes.Let’s give him the benefit of the doubt.She tried to file charges and a restraining order on him but none of it stuck.Okay.
Anyhow, this guy just starts calling to hang out.He asks me to go skiing.We go see movies.We talk on the phone.He emails me.He tries to turn me on to his musical tastes.And I like hanging out with him.We have fun.He is funny. He thinks I am fun and funny.I do not like having to hear about his legal travails.However, that slowly waned a bit over time.So I am kind of interested.He doesn’t make a move ever.So I’m like, okay, what the hell.He is still calling me all the time.So I just stop returning his calls.But that doesn’t work because he just keeps calling.Then, I feel like a jerk.I just kind of got to the point where I’m like not wanting to have these non-reciprocating relationships.I’m not saying I’m in love with the guy but I would have liked it to get a little physical.Right, Olivia?Right.
So finally, I realize that this will drive me insane.And it’s impossible to blow this guy off.So I call this guy to put the brakes on our “relationship.”And he acted like it was out of left field at first.And then he said, well, I guess I can see how you were misinterpreting.And then he gave me the whole I’m burned on relationships thing.Maybe if things were different blah blah which I’m sure is true partly.And then he said all the reasons why he liked me. He said that I was showing him that women aren’t bad.And I was like, women aren’t bad, Jack.In my head, I’m like, I don’t want to know why you like me because you obviously don’t like me enough to be attracted and that’s what sucks. He also said that he liked hanging out with me because he was trying to get into standup more so I am a good connection.That was not what I wanted to hear.
I told him that it was hard to just be friends with him because he wants so much from me.I told him I couldn’t be his substitute girlfriend and that I’m really looking for more than that.I wasn’t doing this at all to ultimatum him into a relationship.I just couldn’t invest in him anymore.So it was a weird long drawn-out conversation.That was five days ago.He hasn’t called.And really I don’t mind.I feel bad like I hurt him in a time where he might be especially sensitive.So what do you think his deal was?Do you think I was overreacting? Do you think I was being a jerk? Do you think he was being a jerk?Do you think he was using me? Do you think I should ever start things up with him just as friends?Tell me, Sars.
All my best,
M
Dear M,
I think you did exactly the right thing.The guy is, from the sounds of it, kind of a user, and either he’s a guy who shoves women around, or he’s the kind of guy who’s attracted to drama-addict women who say he shoves women around, which…is its own kind of fucked up.Anyway.He spent a lot of time talking about himself, you weren’t getting what you needed from the interaction, you ended it.Smart move, and good for you.
But now you’re second-guessing yourself.It happens a lot, especially with us women, because we aren’t necessarily trained from childhood to be assertive with our own social needs that way, and even if you were perfectly pleasant and polite about it, you might have some residual…I don’t know, collective-female-unconscious guilt, not so much about hurting his feelings but about not being a nice happy girl.And that’s normal.
But it doesn’t mean you behaved jerkishly.He sounds sort of jerky, frankly, and you extricated yourself as neatly as you could; again, I think you made the right call.Don’t get too bogged down in what he thinks about it, because if he cared that much what you thought and how you felt, he’d have been a better friend and less of a stooge, probably.
Hi Sarah,
My best friend, Marcia, is getting married this fall to a fantastic guy, Greg. By way of background, let me tell you: Marcia is one of these women who can handle anything, plans for every contingency, cares for her friends, will do anything to help anyone with anything, and is generally completely amazing. Example: She called me one Saturday to tell me she was engaged to Greg, and two weeks later called to ask if I would be one of her bridesmaids. I happily accepted and asked if she had any idea about a date yet. Turns out the girl had not only picked a date, but had also booked the hotel, booked the church, and was narrowing down her caterer and flowers. All this, over a year before the wedding.
So the point is, Marcia has had a firm grasp on her wedding from an early date. She always gave Greg the option to help with the major choices, but he’s super-laid-back (plus, he has that pesky Y chromosome), so he pretty much let her take the reins. Everything was going along swimmingly until yesterday afternoon, when I got a frenzied call from Marcia at work (which has never happened in 11 years of friendship, since she respects everyone’s working day).
Greg’s sister, Jan, has a five-year-old daughter, Cindy, and a three-year-old son, Bobby, who are in Marcia’s wedding (Jan’s a bridesmaid as well). Marcia’s little two-year-old nephew, Peter, is also in the wedding. Marcia’s plan all along has been for the kids to be in the wedding, be introduced at the cocktail hour with the rest of the wedding party, and then be picked up by some trusted family folk to be babysat for the rest of the day, so the adults can enjoy the reception. Marcia’s made it clear all along that she does not want little children at the reception. Here’s the problem: Jan’s decided that she wants Cindy to “have the option to stay at the reception” if Cindy “wants to” because she is “old enough to understand what’s going on.”
Jan’s in the middle of a nasty divorce, so she has apparently been pampering the kids (understandable), but Cindy’s a little precocious, and feeling her oats, and her family is tiptoeing around her (also understandable). Jan basically wants to leave this “up to Cindy”…and if she wants to stay, of course Marcia can’t send Bobby and Peter away from the reception. So there are three little children where once there were none.
Jan’s family, including Greg, has sided with Jan, because she is “having a tough time” with the divorce and all. Greg has suddenly taken a big interest in the reception and, after nine months of letting Marcia plan the whole thing (over 200 guests!), has decided that he actually does think the kids should all be at the reception and doesn’t see what the big deal is. Sars, seriously, this is a high-class event, an old-school Italian-American Godfather-style reception with hours of speeches and tons of introductions. There is absolutely nothing a reasonable five-year-old would want to do there, but Marcia’s worried that Cindy will opt to stay just because she can. There is no room at the head table for the kids to sit with their parents, so the probability of them running around the reception room is essentially 100%. This is not one of those we’re-all-one-big-family things, it is a grownups-celebrating-Marcia-and-Greg thing. It always has been.
Marcia doesn’t feel comfortable talking to Jan about this (she heard about all of this crap via Greg, who heard it from his mom, who heard it from Jan). She thinks (and I agree) that Jan is totally out of line on this, because while Cindy might be old enough to know what is going on, she will not remember this reception after a few weeks. Marcia has been planning it for a year and will remember it for the rest of her life. Marcia’s a terrific hostess, and she can’t have fun if she doesn’t think everyone at the party is having fun, and I don’t think everyone is sufficiently amazed with the Blessing Of Children to be thrilled with three bored little ones causing trouble at an otherwise tony event.
Marcia’s planning to wait a little while, see if things blow over, but then what? She’s considering telling Jan’s parents-in-law (who were supposed to take Bobby and Cindy to their house during the reception) to get a room at the hotel and babysit there, so Jan could check on her kids during the reception. Greg absolutely refuses to take Marcia’s side on this, and Marcia doesn’t feel like she can talk to Greg’s mom about it either. Marcia absolutely cannot stand the thought of waiting until the day of her wedding and finding out then if Cindy is in the mood to stay around at the reception or to go play with her grandparents. Personally, I think Jan is the real issue, but that does not change the main problem. I also don’t like the idea of children or dogs in or at weddings in general, so I am sure I am more than a little biased…that also does not change the fact that a five-year-old is being given major decision-making power over an adult’s wedding reception.
Short version of question: How do you politely ask someone not to force their kids on an adult-centric event, planned for adults, to which children are most assuredly not welcome? It’s a headscratcher.
Children are indeed a blessing, but not at my best friend’s beautiful cocktail party
Dear Blessed,
Damned if I know.It’s one of the most sensitive wedding-etiquette questions, truly, because people who will in theory understand that a nighttime reception with lots of adult talk and booze is not the place for a kindergartener will in practice insist that their kindergarteners can handle it and won’t make any trouble.And sometimes, it’s the truth.Other times, it’s not, but that isn’t the point.
The point here, I think, has a number of prongs: 1) that Greg is now picking up sides when he has heretofore stayed out of it, which I think is kind of shitty of him, particularly given that he’s not picking Marcia’s side; 2) that Jan and her mother are leveraging her divorce to get her a bye on a manners issue it has nothing to do with; 3) that Marcia already agreed to have Jan’s kids in the wedding itself, and at part of the reception, so, while I’m on her side as far as not wanting little kids underfoot all night, that’s a hair she should have split far more clearly, i.e. “I’m happy to have them in the wedding, but after the ceremony, they’re done.”
Because, truly, I get it.A wedding reception is not a great time for a kid, and once said kid gets bored…I’ll refer you to the pictures from a family wedding which feature my brother wearing the garter on his head while playing freeze tag.But Jan and the kids are family, and if Marcia wanted to take a hard line on this, she…should have taken a hard line, months ago, to the tune of “ceremony fine, reception no way” or “no children under ten, no exceptions,” or not had them participate at all.
Yes, Jan is out of line, but if Marcia wants the problem solved and the peace kept, she should ask Jan once more to please reconsider, since Marcia thinks, pointedly, aloud, that the kids will be very bored and might have, pointedly, aloud, more fun upstairs watching pay-per-view with their grandparents.If that doesn’t work, install some sort of babysitting option upstairs, and delegate a bridesmaid to order the children out of the room if they start pitching fits.Better yet, make Greg do it if he’s all of a sudden so damn interested in the wedding planning.
Tags: boys (and girls) etiquette grammar the fam
