The Vine: August 24, 2011
Now with follow-up info! — 10/17/11
I have a wedding-related conundrum, and I hope you (and the illustrious Vine readership) can help me figure out the best course of action.
My dear friend B just got engaged to a wonderful man. The wedding is set for October. Her younger sister is going to be the maid of honor. Our friend, M, and myself will be bridesmaids. We are both thrilled for B, we love her sister, and we’re excited about the wedding. The three of us — B, M, and myself — have been friends for many years, we’ve seen each other through heartbreaks and career disasters, we know where all the bodies are buried, etc. We live in different cities now, but we get together as often as we can.
The history that we share makes us wonderful friends, but there have been ups and downs, natch. One thorny issue that has come up more than once over the years is how M has, at one time or another, hooked up with both of B’s brothers. The first time it happened, M and B’s older brother actually made out in the back seat of a car B was driving. B was extremely uncomfortable about this, and remains (I think) unaware that the two of them hooked up again a year or so later, when the older brother declared his sincere emotional attachment to M. I believe he is in love with M and hopes to have a relationship with her when he moves back home. He currently teaches English overseas, and M enjoys his company when he comes home for a visit, but that’s as far as it goes on her side.
Now, M is a wonderful person, but she is A Flirt. If her hookups with the older brother were all we were looking at, I might get a bit nervous that she would make out with him at the reception (which would be entirely in character, but which would make B extremely uncomfortable), but that would be the extent of it. However! Last year, B and M and myself went on a camping trip with B’s younger brother. In the middle of the wilderness, with all of us sleeping in tents, M and the younger brother had a drunken hookup. B was mortified. She and I could both hear everything.
M and the younger brother were suitably repentant the next day — they’re not really interested in being together, it was just mutual horniness combined with M’s tendency to flirt with any attractive man. B was furious, and took several days to cool down. You can probably imagine how much fun the rest of the camping trip was. I tried to keep the peace as best I could, but I was definitely pissed at them for indulging their horniness despite B and myself being five feet away in the other tent, to say nothing of my awareness that B’s older brother has feelings for M and would be crushed if he found out she had hooked up with his younger brother!
M is not interested in a relationship with either brother, but she has always flirted, made out, and/or hooked up with them if the opportunity presented itself. This New Year’s Eve, for example, she made out with the younger brother — so much for the post-camping repentance. As far as B knows, there was drunken making out in the backseat of her car with the older brother, and a drunken hookup with the younger brother years later on our camping trip, and that’s it. She is very uncomfortable with H hooking up with either of her brothers, and doesn’t like to be reminded of either incident. Her sister, the maid of honor, is blissfully ignorant of all of this (as far as I know). Also as far as I know, neither brother knows about the hookups with the other brother.
So my question is: Do I approach M and ask her please not to flirt/kiss/sexytimes with either of B’s brothers at the wedding? Any obvious amorous action would mortify the bride, horrify the bride’s parents, and probably distress whichever brother was not getting kissed. I would like to think that M knows better, and maybe she does. She was truly chagrined after the camping incident, but…then she was kissing the younger brother at the New Year’s Eve party, so I don’t know. The wedding will also be the first time that she and the older brother have crossed paths since his declaration to her almost two years ago (although I know they have been in touch online, and he really really likes her).
If I say anything to her, I run the risk of pissing her off. I completely understand that my basically telling her to behave herself is condescending and kind of insulting. But if she publicly kisses or hooks up with either brother, it has the potential to be really awful for a lot of people. I don’t know for sure that she will flirt with either of them, but her history suggests it’s a strong likelihood. She’s a lovely person in so many ways, but her drive to flirt — especially when she’s had a few drinks — tends to obliterate her common sense and thoughtfulness.
Do I say something to her in the hope of preventing that particular disaster? How on earth would I even bring it up? Do I say something to the brothers (with whom I’m in touch online)? Do I say nothing and just remain optimistically vigilant (or do damage control) at the wedding? I want to make things as wonderful as possible for B, and it’s not clear to me what the best way to do that would be.
Bridesmaid
Dear Bridesmaid,
No; you don’t; no; do nothing; no, no, no, no, and no.
Wanting “to make things as wonderful as possible for B” is an admirable goal, but I want to point out two things here. First, that isn’t your entire goal. You also want to avoid the kind of horrendous awkwardness that M’s behavior put you in the middle of the last time. You want to not have to pick a side, you want to not have to make cheery conversation when the emotional temperature is hovering around -19F, you want to…not.
This isn’t a judgment of you. I would want to…not my own self; I would probably also consider taking her aside all, “Look: you’ll do what you want, but if you do do anything, I am Switzerland so leave me out of it, you dig?”
But it is condescending, and that’s the second thing — you are Switzerland, or you can be. This is an issue between M and the older brother, and/or the younger brother, and/or B. Knowing about it does not make you responsible for it.
Set a boundary here, for yourself. No need to set it out loud to M — or to B, for that matter, and while I’m up, it’s fine if she’s weirded out or upset, but her siblings are grown men and she needs to corral her feelings a little more tightly — but just decide, right now, “Whatever happens with M and X Brother is for M and X Brother to figure out,” or “I hope things don’t get awkward, but if they do, it’s not my job to play ambassador.” Wherever you want to put the line, whatever mantra you want to store it in, recognize that you don’t want to be in the middle; acknowledge that, if you end up in the middle, it may be partly your own doing; and take mental steps to stay out of it.
If M wants to play careless with a man’s feelings, that’s unfortunate, but that’s on her. If B wants to throw a cloud on her own wedding day by obsessing about who her brothers get it in with, that’s on her. Here’s what’s on you:
…Yeah. Say nothing; stay out of it.
Tags: friendships the fam
And not only stay out of it, but remember this: the bride is going to get all het up over something. It may be her brothers getting into a fistfight about M, it may be that she didn’t get to drink any of the yummy iced tea the caterers bragged about.
At both my wedding and my sister’s wedding, our younger brother did Bad Things. Even though neither of us was yet Over All That with him, it was the little detail stuff (I REALLY wanted some of that damned tea!) that stuck in our craws. (18 years later, I’m still convinced it was the best iced tea on the planet. And I didn’t get any. Blackberry sage, by the way.) There is so much planning that goes into the day, and so many details that could go wrong, and some of them will, and part of the bridesmaid’s job is to start gushing about the deliciousness of the cake or the lushness of the flowers or the fact that she had to fight back tears when she saw Groom first look at Bride coming down the aisle. Remind her that she is amazing and her husband is amazing and her dress is amazing and distract her from the iced tea and whatever her brother is doing in the hot tub, cause she doesn’t really want to know.
But if his whoops from the hot tub become too blatant to ignore, and she can’t be distracted by the photos on someone’s digital, then go make sure her iced tea glass is full and let her deal with it or ignore it herself. You can help with concrete problems like making sure her bra isn’t showing and reassuring her that it’s all beautiful and perfect, but you can’t solve the problem of B’s brothers and M, which will have to either come to a head or fizzle out on its own sometime – and you are a loving friend but not a party to their mess, so stay out of it physically and emotionally.
If M’s good intentions go out the window when she has a few drinks, then asking her not to flirt isn’t going to do any good NOW. I agree that the lecture would come off as presumptuous and condescending, especially if she currently, intellectually, not in the moment, totally agrees that hooking up with either boy would be a bad idea.
If you’re alone with her at any point before the wedding, you could ask her–in a friendly, gossipy way, not in an accusatory or scolding way–how she plans to handle the situation. If she’s currently premeditating going after one of the guys, THEN you can state your case about how upsetting it would be to B. But if she’s on board with hookups being a bad idea, she may actually recruit you to baby-sit her at the wedding, which is kind of what you want to do anyway, right? But only do it if she asks you to.
Yeah, this isn’t your business to sort out. Stay out of it as much as possible. It’s not your fault if someone else behaves in a way that someone (anyone) doesn’t like.
“Knowing about it does not make you responsible for it.”
This is outstanding advice and I’m going to repeat that phrase to myself the next time this kind of situation comes up. Which will most likely be next week.
Do you think it might be worth it to talk it over with B instead of M beforehand? Just sit her down, and say “I know you probably don’t want to think about this, but M’s going to end up sucking face with one of your brothers at your wedding. And M doesn’t have half as much self control as you do, so you’re going to have to decide to not less this bother you.”
If she’s thinking about it as an inevitability like rain or a zit that’s gonna flare up, and knows she can discretely roll her eyes with you when it happens, then maybe it’ll be less upsetting. Or maybe she’ll just be mad at you for bringing it up in the first place. Without knowing your friend, I can’t really say.
@ Mel: This probably has more to do with me not sleeping last night than anything else, but that iced tea business pissed me off a little. If you’ve accidentally said something that hurt your little brother’s feelings during the past 18 years, I hope you savored it for a moment before feeling bad.
But making blackberry sage iced tea can’t be that hard, right? I’ve seen blackberry tea out there before, and you can get dried sage at herb shops. And I’m sure there’re recipes online that tell you what proportions of each to use. I think I need to try to make this, actually. It sounds wonderful.
(Letter Writer here.) Ha! Got it in one, Sars: “First, that isn’t your entire goal. You also want to avoid the kind of horrendous awkwardness that M’s behavior put you in the middle of the last time.” TRUE FACT. And thanks for pointing it out, because it kind of helps me prioritize what has to happen on The Big Day.
Excellent advice; I’m totally on board with Saying Nothing. And I’m also loving the advice from the other commenters on practical damage-control stuff that might come into play if something does start to happen on the day of.
It’s now looking like the whole affair is going to be such an elaborate, over-scheduled whizbang that M’s potential romantic liaisons will be the least of anyone’s worries. (Assuming she could find the time to have them.) And that’s all standard-issue Wedding Hell stuff, relatively easy to know how to handle. I’m less worried about it now than I was when I was laboring under the delusion that it was going to be a laid-back and fun day. Yay?
@ Mel – Republic of Tea makes an amazing blackberry-sage tea. It’s my favorite hot tea and would be fantastic iced.
It’s kind of up to B and the brothers rather than Bridesmaid how they relate to M – it doesn’t matter how much she “Flirts” if the brothers say “sorry, this is weird” and walk away, or if B makes it clear to the brothers that their behaviour bothers her and they respect her wishes to stay out of it.
I totally agree with Sars for an immediate response. However, am I the only one that is getting some red flags here? M has some issues and blaming it on flirting and drinking is fine for one-off type behavior, but M has a chronic history of making bad choices. Like, really bad at least in terms of this family. She’s basically sent the message that once she gets a few drinks in her, all bets are off. Normally, this kind of behavior signals a deeper problem that doesn’t just go away. Either a drinking problem, or a self esteem problem… or both. And Bridesmaid sounds like a classic minimizer/enabler trying to stage manage the entire affair. The thing that really stuck out for me, “if i say anthing, i run the risk of pissing her off”. Of course, people who make bad choices generally surround themselves with people who won’t question, or can be conditioned not to question them. I’m sure M is “generally a lovely person” or whatever, absolutely. And I’m not saying she’s “bad” or anthing, it just sounds like she’s really acting out. I don’t know how far out of college the people are. College is when you do this shit, live and learn. If you’re at the point of marriages and adult lives, etc, and M is still pulling this shit? It’s time to confront, or in the least recognize and not feel it’s your job to protect her amd everyone around her.
Am I alone on this? Overreacting? Bueller?
I don’t think you’re overreacting, necessarily. The behavior does read a little “young,” and like drama addiction, but whatever it is, cutting off the tumor’s blood supply, attention-wise, is a good start, if only so that Bridesmaid simply doesn’t have to deal with it anymore. Doesn’t fix it, necessarily, but fixes Bridesmaid’s issue with “having to” deal with it.
How about flirty girl just take a date (…that isn’t one of the brothers. Obviously.)? She could then flirt/make out with her date to her litte horny hearts content.
Aw, @Mel, you coulda had mine. I friggin’ hate iced tea.
Great advice from the Sars-Master, as always. I think a trait of modern society that’s been exacerbated over the last twenty or so years (i.e., as the Internet and such has grown expodentially) is the idea that because we know about a situation, it’s on us to Do Something about it. This can be good–organizing rescues and fundraising for disasters and such–but all too often it gets woven into everyday life and etiquette and weddings and so on, and pretty soon people feel if they aren’t “managing” something, they’re letting a side down in some way. We spend so much time connected we forget there’s still plenty of room between “M’s a flirt” and “I must do something about M’s flirting.”
Hey Bridesmaid (and Mel! and Andrew!)–
I got married, what, nine years ago and while I was by all accounts not at all Bridezilla, the memory of the awesome catered food I got little-to-none of still rankles. We, too, had fantastic iced tea–it must be a catering hallmark–and I got about a mouthful of it. The otherwise wonderful caterers kept snatching my half-full plate or glass away when I got up to go thank X or Y, and I’d come back to a table bereft of comfort. When I finally got my hands on a flute of champagne I defended it with snarls and growls.
ALL THE YEARS AND FOOD AND DRINK BETWEEN THEN AND NOW HAVE NOT DULLED THE IRRITATION OF MISSING OUT. It can be a long, fairly stressful day, and the mere unavailability of refreshing beverages you’re already paying for anyway just adds insult to injury. That “How I Met Your Mother” episode where Lily & Marshall get married and don’t get anything to eat? Surprisingly accurate.
So your mission, Bridesmaid, is to squirrel away a plate and glass for the Bride, keep them fresh and/or iced, and stab with a fork anyone else who tries to poach it away from you. STAB. FORK.
@MP: Unless that means she gets it in with A Brother, and then her date is screwed too, on top of the sibling operatics.
Yes, exactly. And that’s what I meant by agreeing with you for an immediate resonse. B’maid should absolutely do that, “no, no, no, no, and no, etc”. I guess I was just a little skeeved that no one was commenting on the fact that M’s behavior pretty much lands in WTF territory. This is an issue that could continue long, long into the future. I guess I can say “been there, done that” (as Bridesmaid), and it ain’t pretty.
Otherwise, I can volunteer that the things you are most worried about happening during the wedding- won’t. It’s the other things (best man getting stupid drunk, cake never delivered, whatever), bottom line: it’s not your job! And enjoy that!
Can I snag an invite to this wedding?
Do Not Mess With Brothers. A long time ago, when I was young and stupid, a man Broke My Heart so to get him back I hooked up with his younger brother. It remains one of the top ten stupid things I’ve ever done in my life. Just, ick.
“Do you think it might be worth it to talk it over with B instead of M beforehand? Just sit her down, and say “I know you probably don’t want to think about this, but M’s going to end up sucking face with one of your brothers at your wedding. And M doesn’t have half as much self control as you do, so you’re going to have to decide to not less this bother you.”
Perhaps a good idea, depending on the friendship. If it was me, and I have 5 brothers so this isn’t outside of the realm of possibility, I would appreciate the right friend saying this to me. So I could get my head right about it ahead of time. I’ve gone through all manner of friends-with-my-brothers stuff, up to and including marriage, divorce and children, and there is no one answer. Family, friendship, loyalty, female loyalty, it all gets thrown in.
Thanks for the tea & sympathy, all. You see, it had actual blackberries in it. And I love iced tea!
I have sought out and enjoyed plenty of excellent iced tea since, but it’s just that the petty stuff on Biggest Day Ever can get so fraught (and I had a low-key wedding at my parents’ house – giving Baby Brother access to their hot tub – but even “casual” Big Days are still Momentous.)
(Sis had her wedding in New Orleans, and Baby Bro spent the entire ceremony at the casino down the street. So: hot tub perspective, there. And I’m all ‘take the high road’ about him this century, anyway.)
Bridesmaid, I hope the whole whizbang day goes off relatively hitchless. Or hook-up-less, at least. But at least you’re prepared to rise above, in case.
@Hathy: “making bad choices”? “acting out”? Seriously? Because she likes to hook up with dudes whom she already knows, who like her? With whom she stays on friendly terms? What about any of that is “bad”? Not to get all Jezebel up in this piece, but that kind of language sounds a little bit like slut-shaming to me.
It’s hard to tell from the letter, but it seems possible to me that B was upset because these hookups happened in proximity to her. I don’t like to see people make out, or hear them have sex, no matter WHO they are — if my brother were involved, that would certainly up the Ick Factor. But that doesn’t mean I would care if anybody I knew hooked up with my brother (so long as they treated him right.)
That might be a tack to take if things start happening at the wedding — “not necessarily telling you to stop, but you’re grossing out the aunts and uncles.” Or something. I dunno, I’m with Sars, none of this is anybody’s business but M’s and the bros’.
“Do you think it might be worth it to talk it over with B instead of M beforehand?”
Please, please, please don’t bring it up with B. She has enough to worry about. In other circumstances, it might be a good idea, but not right before her wedding.
My only problem here would be M’s willingness to have an audience. She just sounds young to me- being from a large town where everyone acts like they are from a small town, getting upset because a friend hooks up with your sibling is kind of a non-starter.
Keep in mind that M might be preparing herself for mortification already. She has hooked up with these brothers separately. Now they will be in the same room. I don’t think it would be a problem for you to ask her if she is going to be cool with this or if she is a little concerned about the BROTHERS making it an issue, esp as one of them has feelings for her.
The Republic of Tea makes blackberry sage teabags.
But seriously, there’s ALWAYS going to be some kind of family drama at any wedding larger than a few people. Don’t worry about the stuff that’s Not Your Job.
Because she likes to hook up with dudes whom she already knows, who like her? With whom she stays on friendly terms? What about any of that is “bad”? Not to get all Jezebel up in this piece, but that kind of language sounds a little bit like slut-shaming to me.
I don’t think a little manners-shaming is necessarily out of order in this case. I still don’t think Bridesmaid should involve herself, and we’ve all made mistakes and acted carelessly with other people’s feelings, but these aren’t just “dudes whom she already knows.” They’re brothers, and one of them really cares about her — and doesn’t know she popped the other one on a camping trip. I’m fine with fucking whenever in whatever quantities, but not if it’s self-destructive or blithely dicky, and this is the latter. I’m pretty sure “friendly terms” would go the way of Betamax if Older Brother found out about Camp Chicka Wow Wow.
On top of which, if M really can’t control herself when she’s had a few drinks, that is in fact a problem for her safety as well, but I also think that this is one of those things that has to blow up big-time and give you a faceful of shrapnel for you to get it. And if it goes down at B’s wedding, that would suck in a few different ways…but she’ll get it, all right. Which wouldn’t be the worst thing.
I had an awesome Matron of Honour who made her job to keep me fed and watered during the photos. We had about an hour of photo’s (with all guests) during which our quests chowed down on lots of tasties including Sushi. If it wasn’t for the best MoH ever I wouldn’t have got any of it. I ordered the Sushi specially. She also popped in and out of frame with my Champagne too.
Instead my rankle is something else that she couldn’t help with.
While we were off having the fancy photos up the hill we had arranged for our guests to have Ceroc lessons. Ceroc is a type of dance where while learning every minute or so the ladies step down to dance with a new partner. Everyone took part except for my 85 yr-old great-aunt. It worked out wonderfully as a mixer as all men met all the women, and all women met every man in attendance. Sadly this meant that as we had the official photographer with us, and everyone was on the floor, we have no photo’s of the dance lesson. We have anecdotal evidence, and paid the bill for the tutor, but no hard proof.
So I agree with one of the previous posters (sorry can’t remember your name). Look after Bride, keep her fed and watered/liquored, make sure she gets some of everything, especially if it is special ordered, and I would add, get photographic evidence of special events/people. My Aunt and Uncle have been married for 40 years, but my father is still ribbed about missing his sister’s wedding because he didn’t make it into any photos.
M is a big girl. She can deal with her own baggage.
B surely knows that M (ha!) is a flirt and hooks up with guys when she’s been drinking. It sounds like everyone is an adult here so “butt out” is the only thing to do. Or rather not do.
So, so happy to see the advice and perspectives offered here!
To respond to/expand on a couple of points that have been brought up:
Talking to B about this is not an option, most definitely not. She has always approached the hookups she witnessed with utter denial — she doesn’t want them mentioned, ever, whether she was in full-on seething mode on the camping trip or whether the backseat making-out was mentioned years later. Plus, the wedding plans are rapidly escalating, as is her stress level. I would definitely want to keep her out of this entirely.
Also, yay to all the commenters pointing out that my “job” is to make sure B is fed and watered, because I am definitely on top of that! Helping her actually experience all the great stuff she’s planning is probably the biggest “job” I’m going to try to do. (Plus, super-hooray for tea recommendations!!)
To anyone worried that M is self-destructive or a drama queen… yes, she can be, a little. My instinct is to step up and defend her, all “It may look bad in the letter, but that’s mostly because the letter necessarily didn’t include the long list of her wonderful qualities, nor a contextualization of how she’s a mostly-harmless flirt that most people adore….” Which is all true. I think it’s less that she’s out of control, and more that her flirt instinct overtakes her manners instinct occasionally. Which is a problem any time, and which we call her on when it happens (not super often, obvs, or I wouldn’t stay friends with her), but which I wanted to… maybe get some kind of insurance against the wedding being one of the times where that happens?
And of course, there is no such insurance. Alas. So saying nothing, being an excellent bridesmaid, and running interference (if needed) on The Big Day remain my marching orders.
Oh, and for those of you wondering about age, we are… decidedly post-college-years, heh. We’re all in our early 30s, in fact. Not sure if that changes the issues, though.
Well, I’ve no actual useful advice to add, just wanted to mention the fact that at the restaurant where we had ours the awesome staff made up plates of the finger food for me and the husband to make sure we got something to eat. Maybe we should have given them an even bigger tip!
The last wedding I was *in*, the venue/planner built in a break between photos and reception for the bride and groom to sit in a small room by themselves, touch up, and do a quick carbo-load before the grand entrance. Even wedding party was barred from the room for a brief period. The bride ate cucumber sandwiches and the groom took a disco nap, and I remember thinking — well, partly “dammit, I left my gloss in there,” but mainly that it was a super-smart idea to schedule a break, and make sure the couple took it.
The bride did have time to eat dinner in that case, and made good work of her pasta, but I’ve heard so many brides (and grooms) say they just didn’t have 15 seconds all day to wolf a snack or just sit and stare. It’s a long day; engaged people, find a way to take 20 minutes. We guests can make small talk while you chill.
Yeah, I’m seconding M upthread. B is the one who had the option to discuss this with M, and either she didn’t do it or she did it in a way that Bridesmaid didn’t hear about it. I think it would actually be a disservice to B not to let her approach stand here.
Maybe it’s because my family’s Catholic, so the service alone takes forever and we have had TONS of weddings just for the umpteen cousins alone, but we all have a long (as in a few hours) break between wedding and reception for everyone to relax a little, grab a drink, loosen up the Spanx, or whatever. Plus, since the wedding and reception are in two different places (no receptions at the church), it’s kind of necessary. It seems to work pretty well, and everyone gets time out for pictures and stuff without missing a minute of food or the open bar. I remember being really weirded out by my first protestant one-stop wedding/reception combo because it felt so much more hectic and I didn’t get to switch to sneakers for a few hours before dancing.
And it doesn’t sound like this is something that you can plan for without royally pissing off at least one person, so it sounds like you’re in the right head-space of a “hope for the best, and just get through the worst without any of the mud getting slung on your dress” sort of thing.
@Kerry: I used the words “making bad choices” because she’s repeatedly hooked up with her friend’s brothers, regretted it, and the hooked up again. It’s not crazy to think that’s not such a great behavior pattern. The word “slut” didn’t actually occur to me until YOU said it.
@c8h10n4o2 – That brings back memories of the McDonald’s drive-through on the way to the receptions. Also, since the wedding ceremony is a Mass, there’s no eating beforehand, so the “time between ceremony and reception” not only means transit but FAST FOOD is necessary.
As for the OP, I’d suggest focusing on the bride, making sure she is in as okay of a headspace as possible so if trouble is blatantly obvious, she won’t already be upset. I don’t know if that makes sense.
I just wanted to chime in, not with advice, but with appreciation for Bridesmaid’s thoughtful responses in the comments- it sounds like you definitely have a handle on how YOU want to act, which is really all you can control. I hope everything goes well!
@Hathy, Sars: I guess I read her “regret” as “I’m sorry I did it in front of you” — sort of in the realm of “I’m sorry you were offended.”
I can see myself, if I were still single, making all the same decisions she made and not regretting a thing. So I suppose that makes me a little defensive. To me, “bad choices” are hooking up with dudes who hit you, or use you for money, or talk back to your mom, or have a girlfriend, or cheat on you. Not brothers of your best friend, who presumably were raised well and treat you kindly.
Also, because she hooked up with a friend, YEARS ago, in whom she has no romantic interest, who is now thousands of miles away . . . it’s wrong for her to hook up with his brother? Which he might never find out about? It’s not like she was his girlfriend. I guess I do think that might be a little slutty . . . I just also think that being a little slutty is perfectly okay, and is not the same as being “out of control.”
Dammit, I should have added “or spend all their money on chainmail from eBay.”
I remember watching an episode of “A Wedding Story” on TLC probably 15-20 years ago, and learning that there’s a tradition in (some?) Jewish weddings of giving the married couple 20 minutes alone after the ceremony. I think in ye olden times, this is when the marriage was supposed to be consummated, but now it’s just some nice private time for the couple. (In the ep I saw, it was an outdoor wedding in the Southwest, and the B&G just sat in a Jeep together for a while and chilled out.)
I always thought it sounded like a great idea for a mental refresher during a long day, and maybe someone could bring some power bars along.
@pomme de terre: The ‘yiccud’ is what you’re speaking of. A least some congregations do still do that. It was, indeed, originally a consummation thing. Nowadays, there’s a little room set aside with food and drink. Traditionally, Jews fast on the day of their wedding until the yiccud. My father and step-mother are orthodox and had a little 15 minute yiccud period between the ceremony and reception. The details of what happened in that room are REALLY none of my business.
It’s funny reading everyone talking about how difficult it is to get a chance to eat at your own wedding – I had heard this from many people prior to my own wedding, and had made a firm commitment to myself that I was going to EAT the lovely food we were paying for. AND I DID. But I kind of went on the theory that our guests were adults, and that we knew all of them already, so we didn’t need to waste time on a receiving line and all that when what all the guests really want to do is get on with the eating and drinking already. It was a great party.
I guess I have 5 pieces of wedding advice:
1) Pick a comfortable dress and comfortable shoes. No matter how great you look, you won’t enjoy your big day as much if your feet hurt and you can’t breathe.
2) Make a commitment to yourself to eat frequently throughout your wedding day. You will be happier, and you will have more patience with everyone else.
3) Unless you have addiction issues that rule it out, get a small prescription for the lowest possible dose of Xanax or something similar. Test it out a few days before your wedding to make sure you know how it affects you. If it helps lower your anxiety levels and doesn’t knock you out or make you act weird, it can be a huge help with relaxing enough to actually enjoy your wedding. Sure helped me.
4) If you can afford it, hire one or more babysitters and set aside a kids’ room with games and snacks so your friends with kids can bring the fam and not worry that their kids will “ruin” things. Just have a line on the RSVP card where they can indicate how many kids are coming.
5) Remember that the point is to a) get married and b) ensure that as nice a time as possible is had by all. Your guests really don’t care about whether the ceremony, bouquet toss, etc., goes exactly like you planned – they just want to eat, drink, socialize, and see you being happy. And married!
And from the other side of the bouquet for a moment here:
6) Delegate. Small shit you don’t want to worry about, but know someone should? Make a list, and tell the wedding party they’re the strike team. MoH is on makeup and bustle management in the ladies’, Bridesmaid #3 pushes Grandma’s wheelchair, Groomsman #2 fixes plates, whatever. We love you, we want to help, and if I may speak bluntly, we would rather write the place-cards for you than listen to you freak out about it. Go get married; we’ve got this.
7) No: delegate it, and either trust that it will get done, or decide not to give a damn if it doesn’t — especially once the certificate is signed. The hard part’s over, and if your mother’s friend doesn’t care for the centerpieces, she can buy her own dinner somewhere else.
I looooove weddings. I love going to them, being in them, hearing about them, comparing the cakes at them…I’m Gerty Farish, I guess, but I love them. And I know they are a titanic stress-bomb pain in the ass to plan (and, sometimes, to go to and/or be in, but: don’t care, love). Brides and grooms, now and then, take a moment in your seating-chart despair to remember that, for every pill who’s like, “Cocktails BEFORE the ceremony well I NEVER,” there’s five guests like me sneaking into the lobby to tweet about your amazing cheese selection.
I’m a control freak, so I totally get it, but almost everyone is 100 percent on your side.
Amen, Sars and Other Katherine! (Especially about the shoes. I wore gold ballet flats to my wedding for that exact reason. WORTH IT.)
Also, if you are getting married in a non church venue, and that venue has inhouse catering, use it. (As long as, you know, they weren’t Yelp-bombed or anything.) I got hitched at the Stimson-Green mansion in Seattle, which is a historic residence now run by the state, and all they do is weddings and formal dinners. These people have it down to China. The staff was crack, the food amazing, and best of all, they boxed up some of the dinner AND CAKE for my brand new husband and I to take to our hotel. Amazing! We got there, played with the giant TV, and had a relaxing, delicious snack and drink (also made sure we got a bottle of Champagne.) Pros, I’m telling you.
Let your freinds and family help. One of my fondest memories of the day was my aunt running out to McD’s for supplies while we got rigged up–and thank God. Nobody wants a rumbly in thier tumbly during the vows.
@Sars
“Cocktails BEFORE the ceremony well I NEVER,”
YES! We totally did that at our wedding, and it ruled. I highly recommend this approach, and I would just refuse to invite the kind of person who doesn’t find a wedding in the middle of a cocktail party to be a spectacular idea.
As long as you’ve got a few cocktail weenies on hand, as well. People often eat lightly before a dinner wedding, since they’re planning on filling the tank after the ceremony, and you don’t want a bunch empty stomach + 2 glasses of wine = hooboy during the actual march of the bridesmaids and such.
Ooh, Sars’s comment about signing the certificate flashed me back to the worst moment of panic at my own wedding. We had a small church wedding with the reception on site. Ceremony, pictures, food, everything was great. After the eating was done, our pastor left while we continued to socialize. 30 minutes after that, I realized I hadn’t signed any paperwork at all. “Um, honey, I don’t think we’re really married!”
Turns out, and I sort of knew this, he and I actually signed the license when we got it at the courthouse two months in advance. While I was getting my face fixed for pictures, our pastor took the maid of honor and best man aside to sign it as witnesses, recorded his own information, and popped it in the mail. Very efficient of him, but terrifying to me. And I’m a little bummed that we didn’t get any pictures of the “witnessing,” but that’s the way it goes.
B asked M to be in her wedding fully (or largely) aware of the history. It wasn’t important to her, or she wouldn’t have asked M to be in the wedding. Do what you should do as a bridesmaid. And enjoy the day.
Can I just say that I would like to go to a place called Camp Chicka Wow Wow? Because there’s no way that camp wouldn’t be awesome. (I would forgo going with siblings of any stripe. Let’s just be clear on that.)
If M actually asks other Bridemaid anything like “Are you stressing about the Wedding?” I would totally encourage her to take the oppertunity to say “Yes, I’m a little stressed about Older brother finding out about you and younger brother. I can’t do anything about it, but I’m worried about there being a big scene.” Should M ask, tell her. I doubt she will, but sometimes a little sober honesty goes a long way.
By all means keep the Bride fed and watered (maybe even the groom, too)!
My Wedding advice is Lotion and Tape.
Lotion (or chapstick in a pinch) for the inside of the ring, when people get married they are stressed & nervous and their hands swell. That’s why they can’t put the ring on. Lube it up a little.
Scotch tape. Put a couple rolls of this by the gift table, have some bored, but trustyworthy child firmly tape the cards to the presents . Nothing like a bunch of anoymous presents to screw up your thank you card list.
Good Luck!
Sars, I just celebrated my 11th wedding anniversary, but if we ever get a time machine invented, I’m going back and doing it again because the 1st time around sucked balls and I will PAY YOU to be my MOH or Wedding Lady or Official Ass-Kicker (including my own). Thankfully the marriage part has been great, but the wedding part… SUCKED. 11 years and half the antagonists have passed on and I still get het up about it.
Anyway, if I were Bridesmaid, I would definitely attempt the gossipy “OMG what are you gonna do” tactic suggested above. Mostly because I’m super-nosy and also because if I have a good idea of what Flirty is thinking, I will know what to ignore or shield Bride from when the time comes. I see Flirty disappear into a broom closet with one of the brothers and it’s “time to do shots with the bride, wooooo!”
As an aside, I’m stealing “go the way of the Betamax.” Heh heh.
Since to some degree the comments section has made a left turn into the “how to eat at your own wedding” subject, I thought I’d offer this to anyone who is getting married/knows someone who is. A week before my wedding I took some plastic food storage containers and a picnic basket to my caterer. She used these to pack my husband and me a delicious take out assortment of the food served at our wedding reception. I didn’t have to worry about missing out on any of the good food, and when we got done with the reception, we had a great time eating and rehashing the event.
My best friend just got married this past weekend and on the excellent advice of her married cousin, a fellow bridesmaid, I packed a cooler of sandwiches for the limo ride from the church to the reception. Let me tell you, sandwiches + champagne made for a very happy bride and wedding party. We also gave the bride 10 minutes to stretch her back in the bridal suite (her Mom brought her a yoga mat) after pictures and before dinner. All of the girls ambushed her we had an impromptu bathroom party, like we were back in high school — it was probably my favourite part of the day.
Hey, anyone interested in the follow-up to this question?
The whole thing was basically awful — zero planning on the part of the bride, but sky-high expectations. This resulted in both families plus the wedding party running around nonstop all weekend doing things like finding where to rent chairs at the last minute, running around the bride’s neighbourhood stealing vines and flowers to put in the bouquets because they didn’t order enough flowers and then trying to put the bouquets together the morning of the wedding before our hair appointments, transporting heavy sound equipment up two flights of stairs in my 4″-heel bridesmaid shoes before running off for pictures in a different location that we hadn’t been told about prior to that moment, that type of thing. I could go on and on, the whole weekend was like that. Lots of meltdowns and emotional turmoil too. Both M and I felt totally taken advantage of, unthanked, and kind of like slaves, although to our credit we never let the bride or her family see that. I’m glad it’s over, but I don’t know what the long-term impact on our friendship with B is going to be. I hope we can all just put it behind us, chalk it up to bridal pressures and bad luck, and be friends like before. It was by far the most stressful and disorganized wedding I’ve ever been to. I’ve been a bridesmaid many’s the time, so I know it’s not all funtimes, but this was a whole new level of whack. I think most of the guests had no idea, and the bride and groom were far happier and had a more enjoyable time than us bridesmaids, so we did our jobs well.
M totally hooked up with the older brother after the reception. By that point I was so exhausted and aggravated I didn’t even care, even when the father of the bride kind of hinted that I should go break up their makeout session out behind the reception venue. (The bride and groom had left by this point, as had most of the guests, it was just the family and bridesmaids who had to stay behind to clean the venue.) It was sort of the least of my worries by then. M feels terrible about it now, of course, because this is the brother who has legitimate feelings for her. He viewed their hookup as the start of a real relationship with her now that he has returned from overseas and will be living within a reasonable travel distance of M. M has no interest in a committed relationship with him or anyone right now, and realizes that it was crappy of her to give him that hope. She was also exhausted and feeling really taken advantage of by that point in the weekend, but she realizes that this is no excuse for toying with the dude’s feelings.
Anyway, it’s all over bar the screaming. M has taken my advice to refuse the offer of a visit from Big Brother in her city, and I hope she also takes my advice to never hook up with either brother again, ever. Time will tell. I would like to point out, Sars, that your advice was spot-on, as speaking to her beforehand likely would not have prevented the hook-up, but would have caused animosity between M and me at a time when we felt like we were sole allies against the Big Awful Wedding Drama-cakes. So thanks for that!